Post 9/11 GI Bill Approved schools

[gary-mike]

I hope this all true. As we veterans know the VA system is very confusing an can be overwhelming to understand it.

 

I'll second that! Try figuring out how to do this while still on active duty, seems to make it even more confusing. It don't look like I could support the family with just the GI Bill and full time school though, plus I really need that retirement $. I will figure it out some how, I must feed this addiction. I will fly one way or another!

[gary-mike]

GUIDANCE HELICOPTERS and Yavapai Community College in Prescott, Arizona have a Chapter 33 post 911 GI Bill Program and they are unaffected by the new Senate Bill S3447. The training in 100% covered by the VA and can be completed in about 20 months all the way through Commercial CFI and CFII with SFAR Instructor qualifications in both the R22 and R44. The student services Manager is a Veteran that just finished the Guidance/Yavapai Program using his Chapter 33 benefit. He is an expert in this area. Regardless where you chose to go to school this guy is a HUGE help! His name is Curtis. Look up the school and ask for him before you make another move.

 

Thanks for the intel autopilot

 

I will be giving Curtis a call, I am also waiting on a reply from Yavapi about distance learning. Seems so hard to find a guidance councelor that can actually give you guidance these days.

[Anonymous???]

Gary-Mike, I am in the same boat as you. Currently active duty, and just counting down the days until I can get out and start flying. I will be getting out in about year or so. Please keep this forum going. It has been very helpful.

 

Has anyone heard of any schools in Southern California?

 

Thanks

[gary-mike]

Boatpix is right on this one from what I have read and researched. The R-22 is by far the most used heli in the training environment and for the most part if going the civilian route you will be doing some instructing before you get a job anywhere else.

 

You also should try to get some R-44 time, at least 50 hrs so you can instruct in them also.

 

Another thing to considder is a school that has muliple airframes. This may also be a requirement if yours and your instructors weight exceeds the limit of the R-22. Time in a Schweizer S300 may be a little more than a R-22, but it will be a lot less than going through the full program in a R-44.

Ouch!, check out the negatives I got from this post. (page 1 about in the middle) Note to self "weather a good point was made or not, if you mention Boatpix, you WILL get negative marks"

 

Oops, I did it again there goes my reputation.

[CaptainDune]

does anyone know which school has the most turbine time?

and has anyone heard about how the new GI BILL that will be in effect on august 2011 will change flight training FEEs?

originally some states have been at 40,000 or plus on fees covering flight fees without a sweat. but they are changing it to 17,500 for tution and fees for the whole year.

 

 

I am sure there are schools that offer a good deal of turbine time. Probably at about $1700 am hour. I don't know about the rest of the students out there but I would much rather let my first job (tour operations?) pay for my turbine transition. Not only that, but unless you are going to pay for 250 turbine hours, there really is no point. Is there any insurance company or employers out there that is going to care about 10-20 hours of turbine time? Its like, great, you know how to start this model of a turbine aircraft, but do you have 250 turbine hours or not?

 

I know that I am going to save my GI bill benefits for something other than 10 hours of turbine time that won't do me a dang bit of good when I get out there in the industry. In all honesty I would blow another semester of benefits on 30 hours of R22 time before I blew it on 10 hours of Bell time. 230 hours of r22/r44 looks a lot better than 200 hours of r22/r44 and 10 hours of bell time when I go to get my first flight instructor job in a robinson, not a bell.

 

Just my thought process on the whole tubine thing.

[Blake]

With the Post 9/11 GI Bill you get 115 hours for your commercial. It doesn't matter whether you get 30 hours of turbine included or just do the 115 in a 300/R22, you still only get 115 hours, so you might as well get the turbine time. I definetly enjoyed doing some of my cross country requirements and other training in the Jet Ranger. I've been using the Post 9/11 GI Bill at Aims CC/Front Range Helicopters in Colorado for over a year now, so if anyone has questions let me know.

[ADRidge]

With the Post 9/11 GI Bill you get 115 hours for your commercial. It doesn't matter whether you get 30 hours of turbine included or just do the 115 in a 300/R22, you still only get 115 hours, so you might as well get the turbine time.

 

Why? Most of the operators I know of really don't care about a handful (and yes, in the grand scheme of things 30 hours is pretty much a handful) of turbine hours. It would be another matter entirely if you came out with 115 hours of Bell time and went to the factory course as well, but spending an extra 36,000 bucks just doesn't make much sense to me.

 

I could be totally off base here, but I really don't think I am. I've been around this helicopter thing for about five years now, and I've talked to quite a few guys who do the hiring, especially for that first job. A few hours of turbine time doesn't really set you apart, and I think any school that would tell you 30 hours will set you head and shoulders above the rest of the competition is less than 100% forthcoming. As someone who has gone through flight training (and is still going through it) my personal opinion is that I'd use that extra 30 hours to practice advanced autorotations, operations inside the HV curve or maybe some longline training.

 

I personally think that turbine "transition" programs only hurt the student. They artificially create a perceived need, which is only going to help kill VA funding to helicopter flight training. Now, on the other hand, if I were the owner of a school and I were less than 100% forthcoming in my practices, it'd be a no-brainer to buy an older Bell and charge my students through the nose for a few hours. Hell, they probably fly that 30 hours in a few weeks, where it'd take them months to get that same 36k out of a student in a recip. No, the only people benefiting from that turbine course are the instructor who gets to log more turbine time, and the owner, who gets an influx of cash that he otherwise would not have gotten.

 

In the words of Spike, red circle, lower right.

[Blake]

It was just my opinion, and thank you for yours ADRidge. Any Vets out there who would like more information, PM me and I'll be glad to help out if I can.

[gary-mike]

It was just my opinion, and thank you for yours ADRidge. Any Vets out there who would like more information, PM me and I'll be glad to help out if I can.

 

PM sent.

 

ADRidge,

 

Good point about killing the VA funding, as we have just seen, they are already looking at ways to cut back on funding. The more they have going out to a specific program, the more they will be looking at it.

[ADRidge]

PM sent.

 

ADRidge,

 

Good point about killing the VA funding, as we have just seen, they are already looking at ways to cut back on funding. The more they have going out to a specific program, the more they will be looking at it.

 

Which is why I spoke up in the first place. I'm not staunchly against someone getting some time in another helicopter for kicks. Heck, if someone offered me 206 time, I wouldn't refuse it. It's just that's 36,000 bucks another vet, maybe someone in the sandbox right now, could use later on down the line. That ain't chump change.

[Elcapitan67]

I retired from the USAF last year (2011) and signed up for the Professional Helicopter program at Central Oregon Community College (with flight training provided by Leading Edge Aviation), in Bend, Oregon. It's a great school (not too big, not too small) in a great location (nice town with skiing, hiking, great park system, family stuff, etc)...plus you get mountain flying opportunities while being on the desert side of the Cascades, so plenty of VFR days. The Post 9/11 GI Bill pays for all the tuition, books, flight hours...and totals over $100K if you pursue all the ratings. And if you want to tack on fixed wing training, COCC offers that too!

I'm almost finished with my Instrument rating and the only out of pocket cost has been my $16 per term gym fee and my headset. Another plus is that the Aviation Dept is run by a retired USAF Colonel (John Miller). He answered all my questions and made my transition very easy...and I moved all the way from Florida to go to this school. His website is: http://aviation.cocc.edu/ I'm also happy to answer questions, from a veteran/student perspective; my email is bmartin029@aol.com

 

Good luck!

Keith

Captain/Logistics Officer (retired)

[Azhigher]

Word on the street is that Quantum Helicopters can now acccept the post 9/11 GI bill. Something to think about.

[SH-60]

jeepguy,

I also have been doing my research for when I get out of the Military. I have been looking at this oppurtunity for a year now and decided to go for it. I know there are a lot of good schools around so it depends where you want to live. So far I have visited four CH33 schools, and I am leaning towards Front Range Helicopters. I strongly suggest you visit a few flight schools in person. I have a freind currently going to this flight school and loves it there. He said Colorado is awesome and is perfect for anyone loving the outdoors. I want to have some high altitude flying experience and fly an assortment of helicopters. Front Range Helicopters has a Bell 206, R-44's, and over five Schweizer 300c. Good luck to you finding a school let me know of any good ones you find as well.

[CaptainDune]

jeepguy,

I also have been doing my research for when I get out of the Military. I have been looking at this oppurtunity for a year now and decided to go for it. I know there are a lot of good schools around so it depends where you want to live. So far I have visited four CH33 schools, and I am leaning towards Front Range Helicopters. I strongly suggest you visit a few flight schools in person. I have a freind currently going to this flight school and loves it there. He said Colorado is awesome and is perfect for anyone loving the outdoors. I want to have some high altitude flying experience and fly an assortment of helicopters. Front Range Helicopters has a Bell 206, R-44's, and over five Schweizer 300c. Good luck to you finding a school let me know of any good ones you find as well.

 

The big thing you need to keep in mind about a school like this is that you are really limiting yourself after you are all done. When 80% of flight schools use R22's and R44's to instruct in, you are quite literally shooting yourself in the leg if you don't get hired by the school that did your instrcution in the 300. Without that time in the Robinson, you can't instruct in them, which is basically saying you can't work at 80% of flight schools in the nation. I would be very very careful about doing all of your training in the 300.

 

Just my two cents.

[SH-60]

I would agree with Captain Dune on more schools operating in R-22's. However, If I could choose a helicopter I would much prefer a Schweizer 300 anyday. I think they are a better training helicopter and safer feeling. In addition, you still get your R-44 time so you will be rated in both instead of just an R-22. Granted I only have 4 hours in a R-22 and 10 in a Schweizer I personally prefer the S300. I guess we will see if I am limiting myself but I doubt it.

[Blake]

At Front Range you will end up with at least 50 hours in the R44, so you will be able to get the R44 instructor endorsement.

[RkyMtnHI]

The big thing you need to keep in mind about a school like this is that you are really limiting yourself after you are all done. When 80% of flight schools use R22's and R44's to instruct in, you are quite literally shooting yourself in the leg if you don't get hired by the school that did your instrcution in the 300. Without that time in the Robinson, you can't instruct in them, which is basically saying you can't work at 80% of flight schools in the nation. I would be very very careful about doing all of your training in the 300.

 

Just my two cents.

 

i do agree here to some degree, training on one platform is probably a deal killer UNLESS that school hires you.. (that being said i think front range now has a r44) MOST important is ask the flight schools you are looking at how many of their graduates they actually hire.. if you don't make the cut your prospects drop dramatically. You need to also ask, of the ones that don't get hired at their respective schools, how many of those got hired elsewhere. One of the things i am seeing that is quite disturbing is that many of these folks seem to be told that they need turbine time to get their first job, which is just not true, your first job will most likely be an instructor position and even if you are lucky enough to get SIC slots or some other position past CFII THEY WILL TRAIN YOU TO FLY THEIR HELICOPTERS.. I also have had some come in and say they are being flown up to 500 hours so they are more marketable, We are getting closer to our Chapter 33 approval, but worry that the few will take it from the many by over charging, flying platforms that are completely unnecessary which cost three times more than the ones that matter. For every three students that get 30 hours of turbine time (at $1200 an hour) another CFII could be made (roughly).. do those folks not care about their brothers in arms that want the same consideration as they are provided, the program is already in jeopardy, seems like we would ALL be doing everything we can to keep it healthy for the ones that deserve it and will follow ??? I also wonder how many folks that have been put thru this program have gotten jobs and how many just fell by the wayside with very expensive certificates. Just wondering... I know folks that have gone thru the program in record time and are now in management positions at EMS jobs (they worked as a CFII for one year), i know many more that are now working in non flying jobs because they didn't get hired.

 

dp

[rick1128]

That is one of the reasons we have an R22 in our fleet. We have been recommending to our students that they do their Private and Instrument in the 300 and a good part of their Commercial and all their CFI in the R22. And that covers 99 44/100% of all the flight schools.

[Shaun]

I am sure there are schools that offer a good deal of turbine time. Probably at about $1700 am hour.

 

$1,700 is insane.

 

UND which is extremely expensive charges $750 per hour for turbine. Schools set up for contracts or non-student direct pay in general seem to charge enormous amounts, what the customer gets out of that remains to be seen.

 

I'm going to echo the 30 hours of turbine is less valueable then that amount of money spent on more hours or an A&P.

[Gingerw00ki3]

With the Post 9/11 GI Bill you get 115 hours for your commercial. It doesn't matter whether you get 30 hours of turbine included or just do the 115 in a 300/R22, you still only get 115 hours, so you might as well get the turbine time. I definetly enjoyed doing some of my cross country requirements and other training in the Jet Ranger. I've been using the Post 9/11 GI Bill at Aims CC/Front Range Helicopters in Colorado for over a year now, so if anyone has questions let me know.

 

Hey Blake,

 

I've been trying like hell to get in contact with someone from the school... Is it possible to start flight school using weekends and leave? I've sent emails and tried calling for the last week... (Being in Afghanistan doesn't help... can't leave a call back number) Glad I found someone going to the school... I've got two other guys that are gunhoe about doing this as well... so if you're looking for CFI time... If I can get weekend time.......

 

Thanks in advance

[Upper Limit Aviation]

Upper Limit Aviation is approved to accept the Post 911 GI Bill, as well as the Montgomery, REAP, VEAP, and several others. You will be working towards an AAS or AS degree through one of our partner schools..etiher SLCC located in SLC, UT or Mid-South CC located in West Memphis, AR. If you have questions, contact our Outreach staff at 801-746-1565.

[Upper Limit Aviation]

Hey everyone interested in a top notch flight school where you can utilize the VA benefits that you earned...see the following websites:

 

http://ulaheli.com

http://www.upperlimitaviation.edu

[Flying Pig]

$1,700 is insane.

 

UND which is extremely expensive charges $750 per hour for turbine. Schools set up for contracts or non-student direct pay in general seem to charge enormous amounts, what the customer gets out of that remains to be seen.

 

I'm going to echo the 30 hours of turbine is less valueable then that amount of money spent on more hours or an A&P.

 

Holy COW!!! I worked a little for a guy who had a UH1 Super who charged $1850 an hour! I certainly hope someone isnt charging the GI Bill $1700 for a Jet Ranger!

[indyheli60]

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