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hours in an r44 or not?


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#1 ryan835

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Posted 19 January 2016 - 14:43

hello everyone , im having a dilema,   i am currently working on my commercial and is about to start my instrument rating, my goal is to go all the way to CFII

 

my school recommend me to do my 40 hours instruments in an R44 to get flying time in it .

 

my question is , is it really worth it ?  is it worth it when i get out for a job to have this 40 hours in an r44?  because it is 12000 dollars difference with flying in a R22 .

also wouldnt it be better to convert this extra money on about 50 more hours flying an r22 instead ? 

 

to conclud : is it better to have the 40 hours logged in an R44 , during my training ,  is it really worth the extra 12 grand ?

 

thank you for your inputs


Instagram  ryan_adventure


#2 ridethisbike

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 19:26

Bottom line. You need to make yourself as marketable as possible. That includes having the hours required to instruct in the 44 (read up on SFAR 73 if you don't know what I'm talking about). If you don't have those hours in the end of it all, you're going to most likely end up having to pay for them anyways. Might as well pay for it while pursing an addition certificate / rating.

 

Yes. Do your instrument in the 44 and then switch back to the 22.

 

 

 

One question for you. Why did you get your commercial certificate before getting your instrument rating?


Edited by ridethisbike, 21 January 2016 - 19:26.

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#3 rotornut67

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Posted 22 January 2016 - 08:12

You only need 25 hrs in the 44 to be able to instruct in it (if you have at least 25 in the 22).  I would not spend the extra money for 40 hours in the 44 for the instrument ticket.  I'm sure the school would LOVE for you to do that, I would do 25 hours in it while working on your CFI.  Just my opinion of course. 

 

James



#4 Pohi

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Posted 22 January 2016 - 09:09

I'm with James. I'd do the basics of instruments (learning what everything is and how to navigate) in the 22 and do the last 20 hours or so in the 44. Then do the last 5 or so during cfi so you get proficient in commercial maneuvers.

#5 Spike

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Posted 22 January 2016 - 12:02

I’ll assume the reason why they want you to do the whole 40 in the 44 is because, 1) they only have a R44 as an IFR trainer and, 2) they don’t have a sim…..

 

As somewhat mentioned already, pay for the IFR required “flight” time in the 44 (20 to 25 hours ala no choice) and get the remaining time in a sim, wherever you can find one….. 

 

Lastly, why is this news to you now? I suggest you take ownership of your training and create a solid, “known”, path to achieve your goals. Otherwise, it sounds like this school is going to suck the cash right out of your pockets…..


Edited by Spike, 22 January 2016 - 12:03.

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#6 Jaybee

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Posted 23 January 2016 - 16:57

Review SFAR 73 under Title 14 Part 61 specifically 2( b )(5)

 

The miles stones you have to meet in order to instruct in Robinsons is -

 

  • Awareness training
  • 200 Helicopter hours
  • 50 Hours R22
  • 50 Hours R44  - able to be reduced to 25 with experience in R22 (but not the other way around)
  • Flight training on abnormal and emergency procedure 
  • Endorsement from FAA or designated examiner (factory trainer is an acceptable source, kill two birds with one stone - Factory safety course and Endorsement. to maximize your dollars spent, take your CFI ride in 22 then use the 44 at the factory course to avoid the expense of two checkrides)

"In flying I have learned that carelessness and overconfidence are usually far more dangerous than deliberately accepted risks." — Wilbur Wright in a letter to his father, September 1900. 
 
"The foot rests have a profound impact on the outcome of today's flight ending safely" - My flight instructor.

#7 Carpenter

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Posted 23 January 2016 - 23:36

Ryan,

You have asked a great question-"Is it worth it?". I say "Well it depends". My first response would be- "who's paying the bill?". If you are paying out of pocket then the answer firmly would be NO, it isn't worth it to buy 40 hrs in R44. My second reply would be- "what is your weight?". If you have weight on your side (less than 170lbs) then you won't need to buy your competitiveness, however if you weigh more (closer to 200lbs) you'll need a competitive advantage where ever you can get it in order to advance yourself past CFII. Aside from the SFAR regs mentioned above and unknown by most is that if a school insures their aircraft with Pathfinder insurance (a lot do) a pilot can't give instruction in the R44 until they have 500hrs total time. Summary-You are REALLY going to have to dig deep on determining your viability to advance because chances are the extra $ spent will be a waste. It is also extremely painful if you're racking up debt along the way as well. Just a different point to consider. Good luck in your endeavors. 


Edited by Carpenter, 23 January 2016 - 23:53.

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#8 Radam

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Posted 25 January 2016 - 11:09

I disagree a little with the post above...  I would say it is most definitely worth it to get the minimum hrs required to instruct in a 44.  As someone above mentioned (but its pointless now) you should have handled your instrument prior to working on your commercial since that time could have counted towards the commercial hour requirements.  It will (regardless of what some might say) set you apart somewhat to have the ability to instruct in the 44.  Why would a school hire someone who can only instruct in a 22 if they offer training in both.  It does happen though.  We had an instructor who came to us with close to 1000 hrs in a 22 but could not instruct in the 44...  I know it was a pain in the ass or at least a bummer when they could not take any of the 44 flights.  Our school tried to get them the time but it is a waste of money and I don't think it ever actually worked out.  Lucky for them we had PLENTY of flight available in the 22s at the time. 

 

anyway...if you can afford it, get the time.  maybe not the 40 hours they say, but at least the 25...  not to mention IFR in the 44 is just more fun...22s suck for that 



#9 Jaybee

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Posted 25 January 2016 - 11:16

I believe the OP stated "i am currently working on my commercial and is about to start my instrument rating" - so it sounds like he/she is doing his Instrument before the Commercial  ;) 


"In flying I have learned that carelessness and overconfidence are usually far more dangerous than deliberately accepted risks." — Wilbur Wright in a letter to his father, September 1900. 
 
"The foot rests have a profound impact on the outcome of today's flight ending safely" - My flight instructor.




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