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Logging Cross-Country time


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#1 Yamer

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Posted 15 November 2016 - 17:13

So, I've read the AOPA website that quotes the FAA regulation regarding logging cross-country time. It says (for my use) that you have to use pilotage or dead-reckoning blah blah blah and has to also include a point of landing at least 25nm away from the initial takeoff point.

It also goes on to say this; "For a military pilot who qualifies for a commercial pilot certificate (except with a rotorcraft category rating) under 61.73, cross-country time is more than 50 nm straight-line distance from the original point of departure with no landing requirement. 14 CFR 61.1(B)(3)(vii)"

 

Would that only apply to the military fixed wing guys who are allowed to waive the landing requirement or can I fly from point A to B that is greater than 25nm, do some engagements or OGE hover for fast rope insertion, and then fly home having never touched the skids down and count that as cross-country time.

 

I'm hoping there's someone here that can point me in the right direction for our UNIQUE flying world we live in. Thank you.


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#2 01CelicaGTS

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Posted 15 November 2016 - 21:58

Ahhhh, interpreting the FARs!  Fun stuff!

 

This is how I interpret it.  Anyone feel free to let me know if I'm wrong here.....

 

I don't see anything in 61.1 - cross country (vii) that would justify logging it as such.  It states "(except with a rotorcraft rating)" meaning everything that is described in that section does not apply to a rotorcraft rating.  So yes, that is only in there to allow military fixed wing guys to waive the landing requirement. 

 

So, the only one that applies to us is (v).  Land somewhere that is 25NM straight line distance from where you took off.  Keep in mind that this definition of cross country time applies to meeting the "aeronautical experience" requirement when seeking a rating.  Assuming that the only real reason you are keeping track of cross country is to seek a rating (i.e. ATP, which requires 500 hours of cross country), then you must log it this way.

 

At some point, however, you might be asked about your total cross country time for a civilian job.  If you are not logging cross country time to meet any aeronautical experience requirements, then you could log cross country any time you land anywhere other than your point of departure.  That doesn't have a minimum distance requirement, but still has a landing requirement.

 

What I do, to keep it all straight is use 2 different cross country columns in my (digital) logbook.  One is just "cross country" (I use this for >25NM straight line with a landing) and the other is "cross country less than 25nm".  Now if I want to check my aeronautical experience toward my ATP rating, I just pull up "cross country" time.  If I want total cross country time (not for aeronautical experience), I pull up both columns and get the total of both. 

 

On a side note, if you are not using a digital logbook, you should be.  It makes this a whole hell of a lot easier!

 

TL;DR:

To answer your question....No, you cannot log it as cross country in a helicopter if you don't land. 



#3 Yamer

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Posted 15 November 2016 - 23:07

I do use a digital. You're right, it's so much easier and way more detailed. I do also keep a notebook backup which is much less detailed. Plus there's always CAFRS. Hahaha.

So now I need to figure out how to log the regular cross country in my app and I'll be logging for both reasons.

Ps, I use MyFlightbook.com which also has a phone app. It's free and REALLY detailed and the programmer is super cool and is adding stuff for semi annual minimums so it'll track currency too.
"If one engine fails, how far can the other one take us?"
"All the way to the scene of the crash!"

#4 highside7r

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Posted 23 November 2016 - 21:25

+1 for Myflightbook, using it since it came out and no issues with presenting my times to examiners, at least on the FW side. I've heard stories, but never had anyone actually check distances to verify what I logged as xc time. I do like the separate column for rotary, but in GA FW I just don't log any xc time if it's a local <50nm from the home base. On deployment for both rotary and FW, it's generally logged as all xc.


DUSTOFF

#5 Yamer

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Posted 23 November 2016 - 21:35

I emailed the developer of MyFlightbook and he has created a custom currency option that should make it so you can now add your airframes semi annual minimums and it'll work. I'm going to go build it tomorrow and check it out.

Edited by Yamer, 23 November 2016 - 21:36.

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"If one engine fails, how far can the other one take us?"
"All the way to the scene of the crash!"

#6 Creep0321

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 03:11

I emailed the developer of MyFlightbook and he has created a custom currency option that should make it so you can now add your airframes semi annual minimums and it'll work. I'm going to go build it tomorrow and check it out.


Any updates on this? Ive been using ForeFlight logbook, but dont feel like paying for it anymore ha.

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#7 StockTrader

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Posted 05 October 2018 - 11:50

Armyflightlogbook.com is my primary with foreflight and paper as a backup. Having the NVS/NVG currency split is nice.
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#8 Creep0321

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 03:59

Ive been using foreflight/paper Im a big fan of the experience report breakdown in foreflight, with specific date ranges, and custom fields.

Swift, Silent, Deadly.


#9 BM1

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 20:15

+1 for myflightbook. I once had an error saving a flight to a tail number and recieved an email a day later saying he spotted an issue with that flight and it had been fixed, but since i had saved an identical hour and time under a generic tail number that i may want to review it. Blew me away. You can do all kinds of awesome currency reports and totals for everthing. I track everything from sling load carries and times to formation flight time. Tons of options. The currency tracker us awesome and has a bunch of 95-1 options. Anytime anyone asks me how many days since an xyz type of flight i know in 30 seconds. Awesome to track when I need to srart howling for an NVG reset. Another neat option is it can track as you fly amd will start logging/note take off time as soon as I hit 70+ ft agl and 60 knots (customizable) The map option as great too as it overlays a digital map and shows every time you turn right upto walking to the shoppete if you forget to turn it off. Wouldnt use it deployed of course.
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#10 Creep0321

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Posted 08 October 2018 - 03:25

My only hesitation is exporting my old flights into it. And how well it would merge from foreflight.

Swift, Silent, Deadly.





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