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Helicopter Upgrade


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#21 Discap

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Posted 18 December 2018 - 10:26

Cherminator I am discovering exactly what you state. I keep coming back to the Enstrom. The only calendar limited parts are that TT straps (identical to the one on the 206). A transmission exchange is $21,000, t/r gearbox $7000. Blades are lesss than $50,000 for 3 (and on condition) vs $125,000 for the 206. The list goes on.
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#22 adam32

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 10:03

I would be looking at something like this...

 

https://www.controll...ocopter-bo-105c


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#23 Discap

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 15:34

OK, wow that would be fun.  A touch impractical and expensive, but fun.  I bet parts would only be an order of magnitude more expensive.


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#24 adam32

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Posted 20 December 2018 - 14:43

OK, wow that would be fun.  A touch impractical and expensive, but fun.  I bet parts would only be an order of magnitude more expensive.

 

Lots of surplus parts available and you can stick it in "restricted" category to make things even cheaper....



#25 Discap

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Posted 20 December 2018 - 16:27

So how do I find out more.


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#26 Wally

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Posted 20 December 2018 - 16:44

 

Lots of surplus parts available and you can stick it in "restricted" category to make things even cheaper....

 

Hmmm.  Doesn't restricted category come with limitations, such as:

 

§ 91.313 Restricted category civil aircraft: Operating limitations.
Link to an amendment published at 83 FR 30281, June 27, 2018.

(a) No person may operate a restricted category civil aircraft -

(1) For other than the special purpose for which it is certificated; or

(2) In an operation other than one necessary to accomplish the work activity directly associated with that special purpose.

(B) For the purpose of paragraph (a) of this section, operating a restricted category civil aircraft to provide flight crewmember training in a special purpose operation for which the aircraft is certificated is considered to be an operation for that special purpose.

© No person may operate a restricted category civil aircraft carrying persons or property for compensation or hire. For the purposes of this paragraph, a special purpose operation involving the carriage of persons or material necessary to accomplish that operation, such as crop dusting, seeding, spraying, and banner towing (including the carrying of required persons or material to the location of that operation), and operation for the purpose of providing flight crewmember training in a special purpose operation, are not considered to be the carriage of persons or property for compensation or hire.

(d) No person may be carried on a restricted category civil aircraft unless that person -

(1) Is a flight crewmember;

(2) Is a flight crewmember trainee;

(3) Performs an essential function in connection with a special purpose operation for which the aircraft is certificated; or

(4) Is necessary to accomplish the work activity directly associated with that special purpose.

(e) Except when operating in accordance with the terms and conditions of a certificate of waiver or special operating limitations issued by the Administrator, no person may operate a restricted category civil aircraft within the United States -

(1) Over a densely populated area;

(2) In a congested airway; or

(3) Near a busy airport where passenger transport operations are conducted.

(f) This section does not apply to nonpassenger-carrying civil rotorcraft external-load operations conducted under part 133 of this chapter.

(g) No person may operate a small restricted-category civil airplane manufactured after July 18, 1978, unless an approved shoulder harness or restraint system is installed for each front seat. The shoulder harness or restraint system installation at each flightcrew station must permit the flightcrew member, when seated and with the safety belt and shoulder harness fastened or the restraint system engaged, to perform all functions necessary for flight operation. For purposes of this paragraph -

(1) The date of manufacture of an airplane is the date the inspection acceptance records reflect that the airplane is complete and meets the FAA-approved type design data; and

(2) A front seat is a seat located at a flight crewmember station or any seat located alongside such a seat.

[Docket No. 18334, 54 FR 34308, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Docket FAA-2015-1621, Amdt. 91-346, 81 FR 96700, Dec. 30, 2016]

Just a pilot (retired, so I have a LOT of time)...


#27 helonorth

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Posted 20 December 2018 - 18:20

What Wally said. Can't do much with a restricted category personal helicopter.

 

Conkin and deDecker says the hourly variable cost* for a 480B to be $396/hr.

 

206B is $491/hr.

 

206L1 is $614/hr.

 

BO105 CBS $1,023/hr

 

BO105 S-A3 $1,215/hr

 

 

For me, I'd find a knowledgeable broker to help. You do not want to do this on your own.

 

I'd start here:

 

https://www.helicopt...yer.com/contact

 

*Variable costs include fuel, airframe maintenance, labor and parts, engine restoration and miscellaneous costs. 


Edited by helonorth, 20 December 2018 - 18:26.


#28 cherminator

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Posted 20 December 2018 - 18:48

and a Robinson R44 Raven II is $257/hr


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#29 Discap

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 22:27

The Robinson is only that cheap of you fly 200 hr/yr. I will be at 100 so double those costs.
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#30 RagMan

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 23:50

Your boss wants to spend $500,000 on a machine to fly less than 10 hours a month on it?

 

Take a car. Less expensive.


 


#31 takefootoff

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 01:04

Your boss wants to spend $500,000 on a machine to fly less than 10 hours a month on it?
 
Take a car. Less expensive.


No fun
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#32 Discap

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 15:01

Ragman it is difficult to see the country from 500 feet in a car

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#33 Thedude

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 16:26

Your boss wants to spend $500,000 on a machine to fly less than 10 hours a month on it?
 
Take a car. Less expensive.


My guess is that when someone can afford a $500k helicopter toy they can also afford a $150k car toy for on the ground fun.

#34 helonorth

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 18:21

My guess is that when someone can afford a $500k helicopter toy they can also afford a $150k car toy for on the ground fun.

 

 

He didn't say he couldn't afford it. He said it was less expensive. Either way, a helicopter is a colossal waste of money for all but the very rich. The novelty will wear off before you get your first $50,000 bill. Have fun with the insurance, too.


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#35 adam32

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Posted 23 December 2018 - 16:05

 

 

Hmmm.  Doesn't restricted category come with limitations, such as:

 

 

 

 

A little bit, besides the "densely populated" restriction it doesn't make much difference for a private guy flying around under 61/91. 

 

He's not doing 135 work or anything.

 

Hell, an experimental 105 or Allouette II would even be fine to putt around the country in. 

 

I would NEVER buy a Standard category helicopter to use joyriding. 


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#36 Discap

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Posted 23 December 2018 - 17:15

Ok I am willing to learn something. What are the advantages of a Restricted Catagory for a toy? The life limits and maintenence don’t change. Surely the parts for a 105 must be competitive price wise the ones for the space shuttle.

I am fairly familiar with Experimental Catagory. If you move to Experimental Exibition (OH 58 for example) you are limited to flying to airshows or just within a few miles of home. So for my purposes this won’t work.

If I remember correctly in Restricted Catagory only crew members are allowed on board. So that kills that idea.
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#37 helonorth

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Posted 24 December 2018 - 11:06

 

A little bit, besides the "densely populated" restriction it doesn't make much difference for a private guy flying around under 61/91. 

 

He's not doing 135 work or anything.

 

Hell, an experimental 105 or Allouette II would even be fine to putt around the country in. 

 

I would NEVER buy a Standard category helicopter to use joyriding. 

 

 

That works but only if want to fly around by yourself.



#38 adam32

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Posted 25 December 2018 - 12:39

 

 

That works but only if want to fly around by yourself.

 

He can most definitely still fly his wife with him. 



#39 adam32

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Posted 25 December 2018 - 12:43

 

 

 

Ok I am willing to learn something. What are the advantages of a Restricted Catagory for a toy? The life limits and maintenence don’t change. Surely the parts for a 105 must be competitive price wise the ones for the space shuttle.

I am fairly familiar with Experimental Catagory. If you move to Experimental Exibition (OH 58 for example) you are limited to flying to airshows or just within a few miles of home. So for my purposes this won’t work.

If I remember correctly in Restricted Catagory only crew members are allowed on board. So that kills that idea.

 

Life limits and maintenance can and do change depending on the TC of the aircraft.

 

Your wife isn't a crew member? You sure?


Edited by adam32, 25 December 2018 - 12:43.


#40 helonorth

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Posted 25 December 2018 - 14:48

 

He can most definitely still fly his wife with him. 

 

 

Okay. How?






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