Jump to content


Frasca VRForum468TigerTugsVOLO_VRHome200Helicopter Academy
Photo
- - - - -

A few questions about enlisting then going WOFT in a few years


  • Please log in to reply
17 replies to this topic

#1 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 11 June 2019 - 17:06

Greetings everyone; this is my first post, but I've been a lurker for a while.  I have a few general questions which I haven't been able to find definitive answers to through my time spent combing the forum.  I just graduated college with a bachelors in math, and I'm in the final stages of building a civilian WOFT packet; recently, however, I've been considering not applying for WOFT right now, but instead signing up for an 18x contract.  My 5 year plan if I did that would be to re-apply for WOFT after hopefully serving a term in SF.  If I didn't make it (not something I'd plan on but I'm trying to be pragmatic), I'd still apply for WOFT from within the Army.

 

Now the questions.  I'm not looking for definite answers, I'm just trying to gauge what the general consensus is. 

 

I have a 54 of the SIFT; is this score not going to be that great in 2-5 years when the Army probably won't be looking for pilots as much as it is now?  I saw from the stats thread that in 2014 the average was in the low 60's.

 

Is the military WOFT acceptance rate generally lower than the civilian side?  I've heard rumors of this.

 

Would I be putting a black mark on my record if I stopped my WOFT packet now?  I only have to enter the LOR's, finish the flight phys., and a few other things.  

 

If I didn't make SF (again, just covering my worst case scenario), I'd be a brand new E4 with a degree.  Am I correct in assuming that this isn't really a great position from which to submit a WOFT packet?

 

That's it, thank you for your help!  If there are any threads I should have found have some answers, please let me know and I will go read them. 

 



#2 mike0331

mike0331

    VR Veteran Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 500 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Interests:Freedom & 'Merica
  • Company working for:USMC Infantry, Lawyer(ish)

Posted 12 June 2019 - 13:00

Do you want to do SF or fly? There is a good chance you could make your way in to WOFT after SF or from the enlisted side in the event you fail somewhere along the pipeline (though perhaps not immediately). The only information regarding WOFT, selection rates, etc, is that CURRENTLY it's a good time to apply. That could be the same, more true, or less true 5 years from now. It's really impossible to say. Half a decade ago the military was cutting numbers like it was cool, it's the opposite now, and could change again in another administration. There are myriad other factors that could play into it as well. 

 

The likelihood of you going from WOFT to SF is probably lower than you going SF to WOFT just given the ADSO, complacency, your career, and other army factors. 

 

TLDR: Nobody can predict the future, too many factors and history says this stuff can swing wildly given just a few years difference. 



#3 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 12 June 2019 - 13:26

Do you want to do SF or fly? There is a good chance you could make your way in to WOFT after SF or from the enlisted side in the event you fail somewhere along the pipeline (though perhaps not immediately). The only information regarding WOFT, selection rates, etc, is that CURRENTLY it's a good time to apply. That could be the same, more true, or less true 5 years from now. It's really impossible to say. Half a decade ago the military was cutting numbers like it was cool, it's the opposite now, and could change again in another administration. There are myriad other factors that could play into it as well. 

 

The likelihood of you going from WOFT to SF is probably lower than you going SF to WOFT just given the ADSO, complacency, your career, and other army factors. 

 

TLDR: Nobody can predict the future, too many factors and history says this stuff can swing wildly given just a few years difference. 

 

Thanks for the advice!  I'd rather go in for SF then apply to WOFT, but wasn't sure if it was a good idea to wait until a few years from now when the Army is going to be done fixing its pilot shortage; I know that at least eventually I'd want to fly.  I figured I could get some idea of what selection rates for the future might roughly look like based off of what they were before the Army started looking for pilots, but I wasn't thinking about the possibility of other factors; that's a good point.



#4 Thedude

Thedude

    VR Veteran Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 266 posts

Posted 12 June 2019 - 14:36

Are you content with being a regular army 11B infantryman for 4-8 years if you don't make it through SF selection? You probably will find that your commanders will not write you recommendations until you've been at the unit for a couple of years and they know you.

#5 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 12 June 2019 - 14:48

Are you content with being a regular army 11B infantryman for 4-8 years if you don't make it through SF selection? You probably will find that your commanders will not write you recommendations until you've been at the unit for a couple of years and they know you.

 

That's what I assumed would happen.  It's not something I'd be jazzed about but if it happened then I'd just work with it. 



#6 Kur

Kur

    ATP Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 59 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 12 June 2019 - 15:59

Consider the Army will wear you down. They will get their share of your mental and phsical strength, especially in SF and during deployments. I'd be hesitant going balls to the wall if I knew I'd have to pass a flight physical in a few years. That'd be my main concern.


  • Richie88 likes this

#7 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 12 June 2019 - 21:23

Consider the Army will wear you down. They will get their share of your mental and phsical strength, especially in SF and during deployments. I'd be hesitant going balls to the wall if I knew I'd have to pass a flight physical in a few years. That'd be my main concern.

 

Ha, that's a good point.  Thanks!



#8 z0na

z0na

    CFI Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 43 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 12 June 2019 - 21:25

Drop a packet to become a pilot. If you truly wanted to go SF, you would have signed an 18X contract and wouldnt have thought twice. 18X has a huge attrition rate. I personally knew a guy who was reclassed at the needs of the Army to 92Y (supply) because he was a 21 day nonselect at SF selection. (Meaning, he made it through the entire selection and was not selected at the end.) Going SF was his goal as soon as he joined. He did an enormous amount of things to distinguish himself from his peers. Won soldier of the year at the brigade level, second place at division level, knocked out air assault and sere-c, became an NCO. All of these were accomplished by him in less than two years. He then went back to SF selection a second time and was selected. Hes currently in the 18D pipeline in SOCM. Also, if you became an 18B, what are the transferable skills to the civilian world with that? Just food for thought. If you want time on an ODA, by all means, go for it. Also, the SF Regiment is really hurting for guys right now. Would they really be willing to let you go? Would your CO CDR and BN CDR sign your recommendation letter to become a 153A knowing that youre attempting to leave an undermanned regiment?
  • Richie88 likes this

#9 Richie88

Richie88

    PVT Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 28 posts

Posted 13 June 2019 - 04:02

Greetings everyone; this is my first post, but I've been a lurker for a while.  I have a few general questions which I haven't been able to find definitive answers to through my time spent combing the forum.  I just graduated college with a bachelors in math, and I'm in the final stages of building a civilian WOFT packet; recently, however, I've been considering not applying for WOFT right now, but instead signing up for an 18x contract.  My 5 year plan if I did that would be to re-apply for WOFT after hopefully serving a term in SF.  If I didn't make it (not something I'd plan on but I'm trying to be pragmatic), I'd still apply for WOFT from within the Army.

 

Now the questions.  I'm not looking for definite answers, I'm just trying to gauge what the general consensus is. 

 

I have a 54 of the SIFT; is this score not going to be that great in 2-5 years when the Army probably won't be looking for pilots as much as it is now?  I saw from the stats thread that in 2014 the average was in the low 60's.

54 is a respectable score, the average is 50. I was picked up with a 47

 

Is the military WOFT acceptance rate generally lower than the civilian side?  I've heard rumors of this.

You will  100% NOT get selected if you don't apply, and I guarantee you'll hate yourself for not applying.

 

Would I be putting a black mark on my record if I stopped my WOFT packet now?  I only have to enter the LOR's, finish the flight phys., and a few other things.  

No you would not, but you're wasting valuable time putting the packet together. You're already halfway done. Why not continue the process? You can always enlist if things dont work out in your favor. And by the sound of things, it seems like you're not 100% dedicated to becoming a pilot. I'm a firm believer the packet process in and of itself is a form of selection. Most people dont really want it because they dont want to complete the packet.

 

If I didn't make SF (again, just covering my worst case scenario), I'd be a brand new E4 with a degree.  Am I correct in assuming that this isn't really a great position from which to submit a WOFT packet?

I'm not going to sugar coat this part. You will be infantry and you will hate your f*cking life. (Dont excuse my language, its absolutely necessary). Also IF you get selected, that by no means guarantees you graduating from the SFQC. There are plenty of factors in the Q that can get you cut from the course. Sure you're not an idiot and can ruck/carry heavy things, congrats you were selected. Now you're in Small Unit Tactics, oh you can't lead a patrol? Sorry dude, you're removed for standards. Your entire class hates you because you messed up while in a leadership position and the whole class had to suffer? Sorry dude you peered low and getting removed from the course. Oh you got hurt during land navigation? Sorry man, heal up in the regular army and reapply in 12 months. Oh man you got MRSA (a form of staph infection) in Robin Sage (the culminating exercise)? Sorry man, here's a Z-pack and a route to the 82nd. There's so many factors when it comes to SFQC. I cannot place enough emphasis on this. I'm not trying to scare you or deter you, I'm simply stating the facts and giving real world examples of what has happened to both myself and close friends of mine. Then once you're removed from the course you'll be up for worldwide assignment (needs of the Army) as an infantryman.

Applying for WOFT from AD, you need to show leadership potential. Unless the planets align in your favor, from the infantry side, I dont think you can really quantify and qualify clean sweeps, police calls, and sweeping the motorpool as leadership as a brand new SPC in the infantry. Again, not trying to deter you, I'm just simply stating the facts. So, no, you would not be in the greatest position to apply for WOFT at that time. Sure with a few more years under your belt would put you in a better position.

 

That's it, thank you for your help!  If there are any threads I should have found have some answers, please let me know and I will go read them. 

 

BLUF: If you want to go SF, do it. But that needs to have 100% of your focus. You need to go in with a "I'm going to die or graduate" mindset throughout the entire course. And if on the cause you dont get selected, you have to be at peace with serving in the Army for a few more years to gain leadership experience to reapply for WOFT. Otherwise, given your current situation I would continue with the civilian WOFT route. If you dont get selected then you can always enlist as an 18X or whatever "cool/highspeed" MOS recruiters are trying to throw at you. They're always filling those 18X slots regardless of what recruiters say.

 


  • z0na likes this

#10 Gideon

Gideon

    VR Veteran Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 163 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Fort Rucker, AL
  • Company working for:US Army

Posted 13 June 2019 - 05:24

No one can predict the needs of the Army but overall selection rates have shown a higher rate for Street-To-Seat than regular Army right now. May just be a numbers game for less Street-To-Seat applying but like everyone else has said you don't have to worry about your commander not releasing you from your contract going that route either. Or getting hurt in the SF pipeline and losing elgibility for both programs. Or just life getting in the way and you keep telling yourself "I'll drop that packet eventually."

But if you want to fly, go WOFT now. If you want to go infantry or SF go that route.

#11 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 13 June 2019 - 14:57

@Richie88

Thanks for the help, I'm 100% in whatever I do, but I definitely am not in love with the idea of waiting a few years and working through some extra hurdles when I reapplied.  I appreciate you being straightforward with the details.

 

@Gideon

Thank you as well; I thought there was a bigger difference in selection rates between the two.  Again, good points that I'll definitely take into my decision.  



#12 Richie88

Richie88

    PVT Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 28 posts

Posted 14 June 2019 - 03:20

@Richie88

Thanks for the help, I'm 100% in whatever I do, but I definitely am not in love with the idea of waiting a few years and working through some extra hurdles when I reapplied.  I appreciate you being straightforward with the details.

 

@Gideon

Thank you as well; I thought there was a bigger difference in selection rates between the two.  Again, good points that I'll definitely take into my decision.  

 

Then it seems you have answered your own question. Good luck to you.



#13 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 14 June 2019 - 07:32

Thanks!



#14 Rotodog208

Rotodog208

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 7 posts

Posted 15 June 2019 - 13:51

Put in a street to seat packet, learn how to fly, join 160th or another SMU, fly AND do other cool guy stuff at the same time.

#15 SG189

SG189

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 3 posts

Posted 15 June 2019 - 14:07

It seems that many on here urge you to try your hand at WOFT over SF. Yet it seems that SF is higher on your list of priorities. In my opinion neither is the wrong answer, becayse (as it's been said) who knows what the future holds.

 

I'm 31 going on ten years in and just got picked up, first board. Been a medic with several deployments. I am grateful for them. Personally I would never have dreamed of flying without that experience first. 

 

Just a few things to add though:

 

There will be no black mark on your record for not submitting a partial WOFT packet.

 

An E4 with a bachelor's is a very good thing (I think that was a major reason I got selected is that I have mine as well).

 

Right know Army needs 18X contracts and is throwing a good deal of bonuses at them (Im a recruiter waiting for my wocs date). Bonuses went up this week for them.

 

I'm not saying which is right. Like I said go for either and you'll be ok. You seem to have the mentality that doesn't test the water but jumps in once you've made the decision. With that mentality your character and strength will not be a deciding factor of passing either, it's more than enough. Only acts of God and nature will and you can't make plans around them.



#16 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 17 June 2019 - 10:56

Put in a street to seat packet, learn how to fly, join 160th or another SMU, fly AND do other cool guy stuff at the same time.

 

Yeah, I've been thinking about this too; It's probably the best option.  Thanks!



#17 suda808

suda808

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 1 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Medford, OR
  • Interests:Hunting, Fishing and anything outdoors.
  • Company working for:USAREC

Posted 17 June 2019 - 13:55

A really important note to add is if you decide to go give the enlisted side a shot first you need to enlist into an MOS that requires a security clearance. Without a finalized clearance you cannot apply in service. As others mentioned, I’d drop the WOFT packet.

#18 boomshtick

boomshtick

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 8 posts

Posted 17 June 2019 - 18:10

A really important note to add is if you decide to go give the enlisted side a shot first you need to enlist into an MOS that requires a security clearance. Without a finalized clearance you cannot apply in service. As others mentioned, I’d drop the WOFT packet.

 

Wow that is an important point; I had no idea.  Thanks!


  • suda808 likes this




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users



Genesys VR Forum 200Guidance Home 200HeliHelmets-VR HomeMaunaLoaVRHome200LakeSuperior200BLR 200Spectrum_VRHome200FreeFlight_Home200PrecisionVRForumHome200