cruise475 Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Ok, here is a question or a few.... How come endorsements seem to be a guarded treasure by CFI's who "put a lot of work into writing them" and don't really want to share them. I have spoken to many CFI's about the proper way to write an endorsement and every one was different. They all seem to have something more added to them. I have looked at the AC and that is also kinda vague if memory serves me right. The examiner I spoke to said all he wants is what the book says needs endorsed. Now here is my true question. Can someone give me an example of a correct endorsement for Rotorcraft-Helicopter Practical Test and also one for a Commercial Practical Test. That way I can try to follow along in the FAR and see if I can piece together what actually needs to be in there. Also, does anyone have available a list of R-22 specific required endorcements for Student Pilot on up? Thanks... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flylow Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 FAA Advisory Circular 61-65E has most of the indorsements you'll need. http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance...LE/AC61-65E.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 FAA Advisory Circular 61-65E has most of the indorsements you'll need. http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance...LE/AC61-65E.pdf Ditto that. Also, you can add some of your own wording into a few of the endorsements as appropriate to CYA. For example, you might add, "IAW Instrument Rating PTS" to an IPC endorsement. For a flight review, you might put at the very beginning, "At this time..." and also put in the make and model of aircraft as well as the tail number in the endorsement. ~Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillFly4Food Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 61-65 has the endorsements for the practical tests but not the 60 day, be sure to add the 3 hours in 60 days endorsement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flylow Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Darren Smith has some sample R22/R44 endorsements on his web site: http://www.geocities.com/cfidarren/hsfar73.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootcamp Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Also, does anyone have available a list of R-22 specific required endorcements for Student Pilot on up? Here are all the SFAR 73 endorsements and requirements to write them: http://www.foxchoppers.com/content/sfar73.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helonorth Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 61-65 has the endorsements for the practical tests but not the 60 day, be sure to add the 3 hours in 60 days endorsement.Never heard of a 60 day endorsement. It just needs to be logged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delorean Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Here are the ones I wrote for the commercial (initial) exam. I had a few more for the add-ons and retests. I wrote these 6-7 years ago, so some of the references may have changed. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aeronautical Knowledge Test§§ 61.35(a)(1), 61.123©, 61.125 I certify that I have reviewed the home study curriculum of Mr/Ms ___________________. I have determined he/she is prepared for the Commercial Pilot Rotorcraft/Helicopter (CRH) knowledge test. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Flight Proficiency/Practical Test§§ 61.123(e), 61.127((3), 61.129© I certify that Mr/Ms __________________ has received the required training of §§ 61.107((3) and 61.109©. I have determined he/she is prepared for the Commercial Pilot Rotorcraft/Helicopter practical test and is competent to perform each pilot operation safely as a Commercial Pilot. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Practical Test - 60 Days§§ 61.39 (a)(6), 61.129©(2)(iv) I have given Mr/Ms. ___________________ the flight instruction in preparation for the Commercial Pilot Rotorcraft/Helicopter practical test within the preceding 60 days, and find him/her competent to pass the test and to have satisfactory knowledge of the subject areas in which the applicant was shown to be deficient by his/her airman knowledge test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotormandan Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Look in the back of your logbook and fill in the blanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delorean Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Look in the back of your logbook and fill in the blanks. With the logbooks I've seen.......... That works for fixed wing, but not for helicopters. The wording may be the same, but the regs cited are different. Sign one of those and you're signing off your student for a fixed wing ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotormandan Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 With the logbooks I've seen.......... That works for fixed wing, but not for helicopters. The wording may be the same, but the regs cited are different. Sign one of those and you're signing off your student for a fixed wing ride. Most seem pretty vague. Part ## only with no specific subparts followed by a fill in the blank line for make/model or name of required test, etc. The only one I have found to look for specifically are the solos. I know that not all logbooks are the same (I am just currently looking at mine for examples) but I think they're safe examples. If anything, change the (d) to an (e) etc. etc. etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heligirl03 Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Anyone PM me with an email address. Lots of work goes into a CFI book but I will never understand not sharing. Cheers! HG03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jehh Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Here is an interesting thought... Would be it legal to write down, "The student is prepared for their private checkride, all required training has been completed per FAR 61. Signed CFI XXX..." and call it a day? If so, why? Or why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotormandan Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Here is an interesting thought... Would be it legal to write down, "The student is prepared for their private checkride, all required training has been completed per FAR 61. Signed CFI XXX..." and call it a day? If so, why? Or why not? I don't see why not though I guess it really just depends on if the DPE will accept it. The only argument I can think is part 61 could be many ratings. Even though you specified Private Checkride 61 also all the different categories, classes. Maybe specifically Private Pilot Rotorcraft Helicopter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delorean Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Here is an interesting thought... Would be it legal to write down, "The student is prepared for their private checkride, all required training has been completed per FAR 61. Signed CFI XXX..." and call it a day? If so, why? Or why not? Depends on the DPE. It looks legal.......but what if that student was training in another cat/class of aircraft and had the minimums to take the ride? They could use that endorsement to take a ride in a different cat/class. I know that's reaching, but I would cite the specifics to CYA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spierman Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 The AC has good guidance. However, the FSDO "owning" the particular DPE and the DPE may have additional guidance. Best to use the AC and work closely with the DPE/FSDO in question. It would be nice if the agency, and its appointed representatives (DPEs), responsible for standardization was, were, standardized; but it is difficult for such a large organization. My log book has questionable endorsements.Remember the communication excercise where you passed a message around a circle of people? Everyone heard it different and/or added their own tidbits. Same happens to two different people reading the same passage in the CFR/FARs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollthbns Posted October 23, 2008 Report Share Posted October 23, 2008 I love endorsements, hopefully one day i can give out more! I found that taking the AC 61-65 Echo and modifying the references so that it matches the HELO stuff in the FAR worked very well. Also, I agree with the comments about the DPE preferences. The DPE I send most of my students to has things he looks for specifically. Things like the 3 hours 60 days prior... knowlege test deficiency reference... etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helijay Posted October 24, 2008 Report Share Posted October 24, 2008 I agree with everyone. The current AC has the basic outline on what is needed per endorsement. I would just look up all FAR's as per rating/test you are giving and make sure your endorsement covers everything. I will attatch all of my endorsements that I have written up. I have not had any issues with DPE's yet. Hope they help answer your questions. Also, if anyone has questions regarding my endorsements let me know.CFII_Practical_Exam.docCommercial_Practical_Exam.docCross_Country_Initial.docCross_Country_Route.docFAA_Commercial_Written_Exam.docFAA_Instrument_Written_Exam.docFAA_Private_Written_Test.docFlight_Review.docFundamentals_of_Instructing_Written_Exam.docInstrument_Practical_Exam.docPIC_R_22.docPIC_R_44.docPrivate_Practical_Exam.docSFAR_73_Awareness_training.docSFAR_73_Experience.docsolo_endorsement.doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruise475 Posted November 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2008 Thanks Everyone for your help! I made it through my check ride and am now a CFI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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