Thinking of Selling my R44 for Enstrom 480B

[HeloJunkie]

Hey Everyone -

 

After a year with my R44 and lots of upgrades, I am still looking at a turbine ship.

 

After poking around online and looking at the deals, I have really looked hard at the 480B. I have talked to several people with time in them and gotten their take, but I was really hoping for some unbiased advice from anyone here that flies them all the time.

 

Besides the obvious cost increase to fly it, is it a good ship? How does it compare to a used 206? There are a few low time ships out there that are just a few years old as opposed to the many high time 206s out there.

 

I talked to three shops and from what I have been told they are reliable, smooth machines that pilots and mechanics seem to like, low overhead in the maintenance department and overall a nice ship to own.

 

Thanks In Advance !

 

[BOATFIXERGUY]

Now you've come to your senses!

 

The 480B is a GREAT helicopter. You will love a 480B! Extremely easy to fly, forgiving, easy to maintain, etc.

 

If you want to know anything and everything about a 480B, call Roger Sharkey in NH. 603-298-8728

 

I've bought three ships from Roger. Roger is brutally honest and his customer service is the best in the biz, even after the sale. He will even give advice to you on a machine you bought from someone else.

 

john

[HeloJunkie]

Now you've come to your senses!

 

The 480B is a GREAT helicopter.

 

If you want to know anything and everything about a 480B, call Roger Sharkey in NH.

 

603-298-8728

 

Thanks Boat!!

[Goldy]

Richard- you can't sell the 44 before I can come down and see it!

 

There is a really nice low time 480B for sale in Texas right now...like 300TT for 750K or so....nice deal, and its blue!

 

Goldy

 

edit

 

Here's the ad I was talking about. 280 TT and 700K, what a deal ! Nice looking too. I'll be happy to go down and pick it up for ya, fly it back to San Diego !!

 

http://www.controller.com/listings/detail.aspx?OHID=1135639

 

Goldy

Edited March 3, 2009 by Goldy

[DynamicallyUnstable]

Wow Richard! Selling the 44?!? After all those upgrades???

 

I have no experience with the 480B but the 44 is a great machine for what you do with it, yes? Why do you want a turbine? Do you plan on working the machine? Lease backing it to work? Slinging?

 

Don't want the R66?

 

From the enstrom website:

The 480 has now been certified in 13 countries and has already been operated in 15 countries. With over 50 aircraft in the field now, the 480B is proving to be a popular choice for a wide range of applications, including personal transport, flight instruction, law enforcement, power line patrol, executive transport (charter), electronic news gathering, pipeline patrol, aerial photography, sightseeing, and cargo/passenger delivery.

 

That doesn't seem to be so proven man.

 

You know what a NICE JetRanger or 500 you can get with 700k??

I mean...my gawd this is sweet.

http://www.controller.com/listings/aircraf...1215a56327c5c4f

or, maybe more practical (storage and pax)

http://www.controller.com/listings/aircraf...1215a56327c5c4f

[clay]

enstrom, enstrom, enstrom. i love em. if you are curious, call Cameron at Bay area helicoptours. He wont fly anything but Enstroms. www.bayareahelicoptours.com

[rick1128]

For the private owner Enstrom seems to be the only helicopter that makes any sense at all. Few life limited parts, reasonable maintenance schedules. The biggest complain I have heard from owners is the spotty support from Enstrom. They seem to march to their own drummer.

 

As for reliability, at the 2008 Heliexpo, I talked with a former police officer from Orange County. Their original flight operations used F28's for many years before they replaced them with turbines. He told me a couple of the Enstroms had over 27,000 hours on them before they were retired. They were quite reliable and in some ways were better than the A-Stars they use now.

 

The Enstrom owners Forum will hook you up with other owners.

 

http://www.rockymountainrotorcraft.com/phpBB2/index.php

 

Yes, I own a F28C and enjoy it. Haven't had a major problem in almost a year. Effective tail rotor authority, hi inertia rotors, roomy interior and operating costs that are not over the roof.

[MLH]

Richard,

 

I'm on the same page with you, The 480B has caught my attention after looking at the initial R66 specs (and appearance). I'm impressed with the safety record based on NTSB reports.

 

Mike

[HeloJunkie]

Now you've come to your senses!

 

The 480B is a GREAT helicopter. You will love a 480B! Extremely easy to fly, forgiving, easy to maintain, etc.

 

If you want to know anything and everything about a 480B, call Roger Sharkey in NH. 603-298-8728

 

I've bought three ships from Roger. Roger is brutally honest and his customer service is the best in the biz, even after the sale. He will even give advice to you on a machine you bought from someone else.

 

john

 

Thanks John -

 

You are the second person to recommend Roger. I will give him a call.

[HeloJunkie]

Wow Richard! Selling the 44?!? After all those upgrades???

 

I have no experience with the 480B but the 44 is a great machine for what you do with it, yes? Why do you want a turbine? Do you plan on working the machine? Lease backing it to work? Slinging?

 

Don't want the R66?

 

From the enstrom website:

The 480 has now been certified in 13 countries and has already been operated in 15 countries. With over 50 aircraft in the field now, the 480B is proving to be a popular choice for a wide range of applications, including personal transport, flight instruction, law enforcement, power line patrol, executive transport (charter), electronic news gathering, pipeline patrol, aerial photography, sightseeing, and cargo/passenger delivery.

 

That doesn't seem to be so proven man.

 

You know what a NICE JetRanger or 500 you can get with 700k??

I mean...my gawd this is sweet.

http://www.controller.com/listings/aircraf...1215a56327c5c4f

or, maybe more practical (storage and pax)

http://www.controller.com/listings/aircraf...1215a56327c5c4f

 

Hey Sebastian -

 

Yea, I really want to move into a turbine. The only real complaints I have heard about the 206s is the cost to maintain them. The 480 seems very inexpensive to maintain and less expensive to operate compared to the Jet Ranger. Plus for the same money I get a new ship, not one with 8000 hours on it!!

 

Who know which way I will go...but I really want a turbine, just to have one.

[HeloJunkie]

For the private owner Enstrom seems to be the only helicopter that makes any sense at all. Few life limited parts, reasonable maintenance schedules. The biggest complain I have heard from owners is the spotty support from Enstrom. They seem to march to their own drummer.

 

As for reliability, at the 2008 Heliexpo, I talked with a former police officer from Orange County. Their original flight operations used F28's for many years before they replaced them with turbines. He told me a couple of the Enstroms had over 27,000 hours on them before they were retired. They were quite reliable and in some ways were better than the A-Stars they use now.

 

The Enstrom owners Forum will hook you up with other owners.

 

http://www.rockymountainrotorcraft.com/phpBB2/index.php

 

Yes, I own a F28C and enjoy it. Haven't had a major problem in almost a year. Effective tail rotor authority, hi inertia rotors, roomy interior and operating costs that are not over the roof.

 

Thanks Rick -

 

I will take a look at the forums and poke around.

[fly2pb]

Check your insurance before you make a final decision. You'll most likely need 100 hours dual, and the premium may be a big surprise of that paid for your piston ship, especially if you've been paying Pathfinder rates.

 

Fly

Edited March 5, 2009 by fly2pb

[HeloJunkie]

Check your insurance before you make a final decision. You'll most likely need 100 hours dual, and the premium may be a big surprise of that paid for your piston ship, especially if you been paying Pathfinder rates.

 

Fly

 

 

Fly -

 

Yes, I have been checking on insurance. It was not as expensive as I had thought, but more so than my R44 which I choose to fully insure even though I could self-insure the hull.

 

I may end up having to self-insure any turbine ship that I get due to the fact that I do not have the necessary turbine experience to get a good rate on the hull.

[rick1128]

Fly -

 

Yes, I have been checking on insurance. It was not as expensive as I had thought, but more so than my R44 which I choose to fully insure even though I could self-insure the hull.

 

I may end up having to self-insure any turbine ship that I get due to the fact that I do not have the necessary turbine experience to get a good rate on the hull

 

There was an Enstrom insurance porgram offered by AIG, however, considering AIG's present situation that may not be available. But look into it. Also some other ways to cut down your insurance bill would be to jack up the open pilot clause to very high limits like 10,000 total time 5,000 hours helicopter and 5,000 hours time in type. Then put yourself and any other who flies it on by name only. I did that with my Enstrom and it cut the premium by over $2000.

 

Be careful when you shop around, many of the insurance companies will stick it to you or refuse to deal with you if you use more than one broker.

[HeloJunkie]

There was an Enstrom insurance porgram offered by AIG, however, considering AIG's present situation that may not be available. But look into it. Also some other ways to cut down your insurance bill would be to jack up the open pilot clause to very high limits like 10,000 total time 5,000 hours helicopter and 5,000 hours time in type. Then put yourself and any other who flies it on by name only. I did that with my Enstrom and it cut the premium by over $2000.

 

Be careful when you shop around, many of the insurance companies will stick it to you or refuse to deal with you if you use more than one broker.

 

Hey Rick -

 

That is great information, I think I will try that out !!

[fly2pb]

Hull insurance is one thing - it's liability I'd be concerned with. 1mm coverage doesn't go very far. Expect seat limitations at that until you get 500 hours.

Protect your a$$ets!!

 

Fly

Edited March 5, 2009 by fly2pb

[svtcobra66]

You can access the Enstrom Insurance Program through Air-Sure, Ltd based in Colorado. Tammy Clark is the person you want to speak with, that will be the best rate out there for an Enstrom. The more hours you have, the better the price will be, and the standard liability is going to be $1,000,000 subject to $100,000 per passenger. You'll be hard-pressed to get higher limits at a reasonable price, unless you've got several thousand hours. Helicopters are notoriously expensive to insure, unless you're a municipality.

[HeloJunkie]

You can access the Enstrom Insurance Program through Air-Sure, Ltd based in Colorado. Tammy Clark is the person you want to speak with, that will be the best rate out there for an Enstrom. The more hours you have, the better the price will be, and the standard liability is going to be $1,000,000 subject to $100,000 per passenger. You'll be hard-pressed to get higher limits at a reasonable price, unless you've got several thousand hours. Helicopters are notoriously expensive to insure, unless you're a municipality.

 

 

Thanks - I'll give them a call and see what happens!!

[BOATFIXERGUY]

Did you find one yet?

[HeloJunkie]

Did you find one yet?

 

Well.....the few people that I have found selling them are not aware what the economy looks like, so I think I will wait out the price and see what it looks like in another 12 months!!

[rick1128]

Well.....the few people that I have found selling them are not aware what the economy looks like, so I think I will wait out the price and see what it looks like in another 12 months!!

 

I would keep in mind that the Enstrom is not a commodity helicopter like the Robbie is. The price is reasonably stable. It is a small market as Enstrom make a lot fewer 480's than Robinson makes R44's.

[BOATFIXERGUY]

I would keep in mind that the Enstrom is not a commodity helicopter like the Robbie is. The price is reasonably stable. It is a small market as Enstrom make a lot fewer 480's than Robinson makes R44's.

 

I was going to say the same thing Rick!

[adam32]

Well...what have you decided???

[BOATFIXERGUY]

Ya, what gives!? When do we get to see all of the pictures of the improvements and mods you are going to do! Tons of room in a 480 for all kinds of toys!

[adam32]

Ya, what gives!? When do we get to see all of the pictures of the improvements and mods you are going to do! Tons of room in a 480 for all kinds of toys!

 

Umm...dual 530W's, 696, radar altimeter, hook, NightSun, PA system, siren, ohh the fun I could have with one!!