Logging PIC and doing a R/W addon

[citation560]

I'm in the process of starting my Comm R/W add-on. I was wondering what everyone's interpretation of 61.51(e) para (B and C). Paragraph B is telling me that if I'm in an approved Pilot in Command training program working on the 9 items listed, that I can log PIC while performing the duties of PIC even though I'm not rated in category and class. And that I am under the supervision of a CFI that is rated in the category and class of aircraft. The requirements of the supervising pilot is in para (C). And para (D) states what the supervising pilot has to log in the logbook. This is all directed to the 35 hrs of PIC required.

 

Just wanted to get the thoughts of others and how they read it. I also included a link to an interesting article on doing your add-on.

http://helicopterflight.net/Add%20on.htm. Thanks and hope to hear on your thoughts.

[bqmassey]

(A) says you have to have category and class.

[citation560]

(A) also doesn't mention anything about a private rating, which would make you rated in category and class.

[bqmassey]

(A) also doesn't mention anything about a private rating, which would make you rated in category and class.

 

Right. For you to log PIC time under (e)(iv), you must have commercial or ATP privileges in that category and class.

[Eric Hunt]

Stop trying to cut corners.

 

You are not rated on a helicopter, and not rated on the type, so how can you possibly be the pilot in command? This is dual instruction.

 

Do the hours dual, then when you get rated, log PIC if you are able.

[WolftalonID]

That article was very well written....and does address the point very frankly. FAR's are often interpreted, when in fact they should be read. Great insight, thanks for posting it.

[iChris]

I'm in the process of starting my Comm R/W add-on. I was wondering what everyone's interpretation of 61.51(e) para (B and C). Paragraph B is telling me that if I'm in an approved Pilot in Command training program working on the 9 items listed, that I can log PIC while performing the duties of PIC even though I'm not rated in category and class. And that I am under the supervision of a CFI that is rated in the category and class of aircraft. The requirements of the supervising pilot is in para (C). And para (D) states what the supervising pilot has to log in the logbook. This is all directed to the 35 hrs of PIC required.

 

Just wanted to get the thoughts of others and how they read it. I also included a link to an interesting article on doing your add-on.

 

http://helicopterflight.net/Add%20on.htm. Thanks and hope to hear on your thoughts.

 

§61.51[e][1][iv] doesn’t really apply to your situation. The pilot performing the duties of pilot in command, under this rule, must hold a commercial or airline transport pilot certificate and aircraft rating that is appropriate to the category and class of aircraft being flown. Unless you already hold a rotorcraft/helicopter category and class, this provision will not work for you.

 

The §61.51[e][1][iv] revision was basically written to allow the pilot of an aircraft were a type rating is required, the ability to log PIC time while training for the type rating.

 

The only way currently for a pilot to log PIC time (notwithstanding §61.51[e][1][iii]) without a type rating (if a type rating is required for that aircraft) is under this rule which requires an approved training program be setup and the supervising pilot hold a flight instructors certificate or ATP. That's something your company can setup with your FSDO. 


 

The FAA made clarification in their Final Rules Notice, effective April 4, 1997. This made clear that the SIC needs a type rating in the aircraft (if one is required for that aircraft) to log PIC time. However, the FAA did state in the notice that those SIC pilots who logged PIC without a type rating (prior to the 1997 final rule) did not have to revisit past loggings. In effect a type of grandfathering.

 

Saudi Aramco initially petitioned for this rule. Saudi Aramco wanted permission to allow new hires' training in their Bell 214 helicopter to eventually become Captains in the company and allow logging PIC flight time while under the supervision of more experienced and senior pilots.

 

61.51[e][1][iv] Final rule 2009 - Page 42514 revision #26

Edited November 21, 2013 by iChris