Beginning my WOFT selection adventure

[Caelus]

Hey all,

 

(This post is awfully long, sorry)

 

I have been reading on this forum for many months now, I have been following the selection board posts since the September board and the amount of information I have gleaned from those alone makes me want to buy everyone on this forum a cold beverage of their choosing for all the hard work they have done that it has saved me from doing. Not to mention the exhaustive guide that the poster Lindsey put together, wow. So yeah, first and foremost a huge thanks to all of you for your contributions.

 

I am tired of just lurking around in here, I wanted to go ahead and get active so I'll do a little intro.

 

I am a 27 year old prior active Air Force (currently reserve) enlisted guy where I was a 3C0X1, now 3D0X2 Cyber Systems Ops (IT stuff basically), attending NC State for a double major in Computer and Electrical Engineering, I should graduate May2015. To put it plainly, I want desperately to fly for the Army as a Warrant Officer. I don't have any flight experience, but I consider myself an aviation enthusiast with enough knowledge about the military and aviation to know that it's definitely where I want to be. My ASVAB scores from my initial entry were good, I don't know if I'll need to retake it just for this program or what, I'd probably like to, I think I could do better by studying. My PT is not so good right now, I've been pretty sedentary since I got out in 09 and started school, but I've been in pretty damn good shape at times in my life, and I still remember how to do it, so hopefully with a few months of working PT back into my life I'll be good to go. As it stands it looks like at just under 5'9" I need to be like 170 to join the Army, and right now I'm like 200, and I probably couldn't run 2 miles any faster than about 17 minutes (this PT thing might be harder than I'm psyching myself out for it to be), but I have been trying to ease myself back into it after letting some shin splints heal up from being in too much of a hurry to shape up. As a matter of fact I ran 5 miles Sunday, even though they were 5 slooow miles. Also, I had PRK surgery in late December and everything is perfect with that. I still need to get some paperwork done by the doctor.

 

I don't know if many of you have struggled with something like this, but on the off chance that you have and can offer some advice: I have been in school full time since Jan2010 at community college and now NCSU. I'm majoring in something that at one time was very interesting to me, and still is somewhat, and in a program I worked hard to get in to, but if it weren't for the idea of feeling like I would be wasting 5 years of my life that I spent working on this degree, I would quit school right now to go to WOFT and never look back. Most days I tell myself it's unreasonable to get within a year of graduating and then quit, but some days the urge to get in and start flying is so much greater than the one to keep my head down and keep studying, and for something that if I do get selected, which damn sure is the plan, I will never ever use! That's my major dilemma right now, Get my stuff together for the July14 board and get where I want to be today worry about getting a degree later, or suck it up and finish and get my stuff together for 2015 possibly risking the selection numbers getting worse, maybe even much worse!

 

I think that's all there is to say about myself.

 

Now for a couple of questions I haven't found the answer to.

 

1) The first one I can think of is, for those of you who have attended more than one/many different schools, is the GPA that you are putting in your stats (is it even in the packet or do they just look over your transcripts?) combined or the one you graduated with? I haven't been doing so hot lately and my NCSU GPA alone is significantly lower than my overall college GPA.

 

2) I haven't gone to the recruiter yet because I know my PT currently is far from where it should be, is this the right choice?

 

3) How does prior service stack up against non prior service when it comes to selection? I believe some people here have the numbers that come out after each board, if such detailed info is on there I'd like to hear about it. I have 2 achievement medals, a deployment and perfect EPRs, I'm no combat infantryman, but it seems like it would have to help.

 

4) I havent tried to get any LORs yet, my thinking is that I want to be able to sit down to an interview with someone I am seeking an LOR from, for instance I am hoping to be able to interview with my reserve wing commander, a 1-star pilot with over 7000 hours (I hope that's a worthwhile LOR), I want to show him that I blew the SIFT out of the water, have been killing my PT, and have all my other stuff squared away so that he can see for himself that I have what it takes and therefore writes me a stronger LOR. I see chasing LORs down now as putting the carriage before the horse or however that saying goes, I can't think of a better one, like are these people supposed to take their time to write me an LOR before anyone knows if I'm even qualified to get into the program? No flight physical, no test results, no PT score.

 

5) I currently hold an active TS clearance, which I can show documentation of, do I have to fill out this SF86? That wouldn't make sense but I don't see anything that says otherwise.

 

Just because I can't say it enough I'll say one more time, thank you thank you thank you to everyone here for your help.

[Ardo09203]

I'll try to be brief, but please by all means feel free to PM with additional questions.

 

The degree- Do not stop school to apply for WOFT, do them hand in hand. Keep hacking away at it until you are officially selected, in that case, you should be able to use your orders to drop your classes without any negative repercussions. If this ends up being the case, MAKE SURE YOU GO BACK AND FINISH!!!

 

The GPA- I would assume you use a cumulative GPA from all college level schooling.

 

The Recruiter- GO NOW! Be upfront about it when you call though. My recruiter knows I was overweight but chose to take me anyway knowing I was working on it. My PT is terrible at the moment, but the more steps I complete the more motivation I have to keep at it.

 

No idea about the prior service question.

 

I don't think you will have to retake the ASVAB, however if your initial GT is lower than 110, I believe there is a partial test you can take to raise it.

 

As far as the LoR's go, I would mention it to the people that you you intend to have write on , and tell them that you are applying and have considered speaking with them for a LoR. They may be all about it. Once you have passed the flight phys and SIFT (Know that the only thing that stands between you and the board is a PT score), then ask them to write it.

 

I think you are good on the clearance, but really have no idea what they will make you do.

 

Good Luck!!

[Caelus]

Thanks Ardo, hopefully I can get some stats from board results and figure out for myself how much difference being prior service makes, if no one knows.

 

I wasn't planning on stopping school to apply, I wouldn't see much sense in that, more like if I start the process with the intention of getting boarded before I finish school. I've been reading a lot on here today, a lot more rather, and it seems like if I start the process now, I should be lucky to ship out by next summer if I get selected on the first board I'm on. Still, the idea of starting now and things miraculously moving quickly... what would I do? I mean if that did actually happen I know I would take the seat in WOFT if it had me leaving before graduating, I mean I couldn't say no at that point.

 

I know I had high enough ASVAB scores, I just don't know if they consider them still usable. Not a big deal either way.

 

I'll take your advice and go ahead and get in contact with a recruiter, it couldn't hurt, right?

 

Anyone have experience with recruiters in NC?

[2ndGen]

Pretty sure you ASVAB score is yours for life. Most prior service guys have either little to no college or maybe an associates, so you will stack up just fine with them. The PT thing. Its not an end all be all, do the best you can, they want a well rounded applicant. That being said, a great score is a great discriminator.

 

PM with an other questions.

[Yamer]

I took an asvab in 2002 in high school and had to take another one in 2012 when I enlisted. They expire but I can't remember the time frame they told me

[firepilot42]

I'm just a recent selectee with no prior service so the only assistance I can provide is don't worry about pt, go to a recruiter. Constant improvement will show them you're serious and determined that WOFT is what you want.

 

My PT Stats through WOFT application process.

Day 1 call to recruiter, 30 years old 5'11 215lbs. PT score 164

6 months later, 31 years old 5'11 165lbs. PT score 275

 

Good Luck!!!

[Ardo09203]

I'm just a recent selectee with no prior service so the only assistance I can provide is don't worry about pt, go to a recruiter. Constant improvement will show them you're serious and determined that WOFT is what you want.

 

My PT Stats through WOFT application process.

Day 1 call to recruiter, 30 years old 5'11 215lbs. PT score 164

6 months later, 31 years old 5'11 165lbs. PT score 275

 

Good Luck!!!

 

Good Stuff!

[Caelus]

My PT Stats through WOFT application process.

Day 1 call to recruiter, 30 years old 5'11 215lbs. PT score 164

6 months later, 31 years old 5'11 165lbs. PT score 275

 

Good Luck!!!

Hopefully that's me! Thanks!

[Rob1341]

Asvab good for two years if you're not in military.

[Caelus]

Asvab good for two years if you're not in military.

 

Even if it's good, I want to take it again. I'm pretty sure my GT was like a 119, I reverse calculated it using my Air Force MAGE scores, and I think I could do better than that if I studied a book. My AFQT however, I have no idea, like a 90 maybe, so there's room for improvement there.

[Caelus]

So first things first, I'm going to a local recruiter today, fingers crossed that they've done one of these before. I guess I'll try to get scheduled for the SIFT and/or the ASVAB again, ask about the SF86 since I already hold a clearance, I'm also going to ask about MEPS since I also already have complete military medical records that are up to date, and it's probably too early to talk about trying to schedule a future flight physical. Is it 3 months or 6? I hear 6, but I hear 3 also... This aeromedical policy letter PDF says 3...

 

Also, regarding laser corrective surgery, I thought I had it figured out what I needed from my doctor, but reading over the policy again it seems that maybe there are other tests required than just what is on that checklist? Maybe all the medical terminology is just messing me up.

 

Anybody have tips for vetting recruiters, other than if they have experience with Warrant or OCS packets?

[Ardo09203]

So first things first, I'm going to a local recruiter today, fingers crossed that they've done one of these before. I guess I'll try to get scheduled for the SIFT and/or the ASVAB again, ask about the SF86 since I already hold a clearance, I'm also going to ask about MEPS since I also already have complete military medical records that are up to date, and it's probably too early to talk about trying to schedule a future flight physical. Is it 3 months or 6? I hear 6, but I hear 3 also... This aeromedical policy letter PDF says 3...

 

Also, regarding laser corrective surgery, I thought I had it figured out what I needed from my doctor, but reading over the policy again it seems that maybe there are other tests required than just what is on that checklist? Maybe all the medical terminology is just messing me up.

 

Anybody have tips for vetting recruiters, other than if they have experience with Warrant or OCS packets?

 

Instead of wasting the gas, call around to different recruiting stations and ask, "Is anyone with this station familiar with putting together WOFT packets for civilians"? If they don't even know what WOFT is, the answer is NO. The second you mention OCS however, you are going to get hit with "Nope, Sorry OCS applications are frozen right now....."

 

Make sure they are familiar with WOFT specifically. If once you call around to find no one familiar with them. I'd try to take my chances with the station that sounded the most confident, and work with the recruiter to help get the the process rolling. Just question ANYTHING he says that doesn't line up with what you've learned here.

[UH60L-IP]

I'm not convinced that experience with WOFT applicants is a pre-requisite for a good recruiter. I simply walked into the nearest recruiter's office and made it known what I wanted. I had very good luck and found a fairly new recruiter that basically said, "We've never done one. We don't know how to do one. But I am a hard charger and I want to learn how to do one." I stayed in the recruiter's office for about 11 hours that day. By the time I left I had MEPS, physical, AFAST, etc all scheduled. There was a bit of luck but I did my part as well. Within 24 hours I had contacted the right people and had letter's of recommendation in hand. I did my PT test within 48 hours of first contact with the recruiter. When I went to MEPS I met the commander, a UH-60 pilot, and he apparently liked me. He pushed some paperwork through rather quickly.

 

Long story short, I was selected and scheduled for WOCS about 3 weeks after I first walked into the recruiter's office with a recruiter who didn't know anything but wanted the experience of processing a "quality" selectee. As a prior service (but then civilian) applicant, I was at WOCS about 5 1/2 weeks after I first decided to apply - oh, and I started in November so my process took me over the Thanksgiving holiday and right up to Christmas exodus.

 

Your mileage may vary, and I know I am the exception to the rule, but I am convinced that much of the process is based upon how diligent you are in getting things done. Find a willing recruiter and when they ask for something, get it to them without delay.

[SBuzzkill]

I had a similar experience. The longest wait was for my eyesight to be approved by Fort Rucker which took another month but even though my physical wasn't approved yet I still went to the battalion board. But start to finish, aside from waiting, I was done in one month.

[Flim]

Wow, that was quick ride brother... I think you were the exception!

 

I got held up in meps, otherwise I would have had it done in 2 months.

[cwil7280]

Isn't it a requirement to have an LOR from at least one Warrant aviator? Or is that just something I have heard?

[Ardo09203]

Isn't it a requirement to have an LOR from at least one Warrant aviator? Or is that just something I have heard?

AD Only

[Caelus]

I can't believe how fast you guys got all this done! Forget all the appointments, maybe it's on account on being in school and spending so much time studying, but I can't imagine writing a good essay and resume and getting good enough LORs in just a month or two.

 

Thanks for all the feedback. I know a good recruiter who is brand new could do a great job, it just seems like with someone experienced I would avoid a lot of stuff I've heard about packets not actually getting boarded when they were supposed to or long delays for no reason, stuff being done wrong so the packet is not getting looked at on the board... having said all that I'll probably just go to the local guy and give them a chance unless they give a bad vibe or lie to me or try to convince me to enlist 11B if I really want to have a shot lol.

 

Isn't it a requirement to have an LOR from at least one Warrant aviator? Or is that just something I have heard?

While it's not officially required for civ applicants, it seems to me that it would really hurt your packet not to have one.

[firepilot42]

My recruiter had never done a WOFT application before. I had all of my LOR's, Meps physical and testing done within 1 month and flight physical the following month but was delayed another 8 months for various reasons (excuses). I'm pretty sure the delays were because they had to make sure I was going to get in shape before they would submit it.

[SBuzzkill]

My letters of rec were from a high school teacher, my CFI, and my boss at work. Sure a warrant officer LOR might boost your packet but if everything else is completed I wouldn't hold off on submitting a packet because there's no LOR from a warrant.

 

I had my boss help me with my resume and it turned out nicely. A simple summary of the jobs you've had and how they relate to what you're applying for is all you need. Mine took me about an hour to write up and format, and then maybe 30 more minutes to make changes once my boss reviewed it.

 

The essay took a bit more work but I just used strategies I had learned for writing essays during AP testing. I had my recruiter review it and we made some changes to give it a more leadership oriented nature as well as polishing up some words to change me "wanting" to be an aviator to "needing" to be an aviator.

 

All in all it was an easy process due to having a GREAT recruiter. I shopped around a little bit and got pretty damn lucky. High test scores did wonders for me as well since my GPA wasn't great although I did manage a 3.3 for the year that I went to college.

 

I had ~70 hours of flight time and a few years experience working as a line guy helping my aviation motivation out as well. Pretty much I focused my packet to allow my passion for aviation to shine through as well as my desire to serve in a leadership role.

[Caelus]

Thanks for the tips SBuzzKill. Even without having worked in aviation, I think gearing your package toward having a passion of aviation and being a good leader to be rock solid advice, I'll take it.

 

I just got back from the recruiter. They were initially a little weary of me wanting to put in a WOFT packet, especially since I'm out of shape, I almost thought they were going to tell me to gtfo of the office with my fat self lol. I told them I was planning on getting in great shape as it was necessary to be competitive, and I hinted more that I knew about the process and what it was going to take and they eased up some and then ended up sitting with the center commander (SFC) for a couple hours talking about everything and just BSing. They said I have to get the DD368 conditional release done before they can officially do anything with me, so I'll be doing that next time I go to drill. They also told me that they weren't going to send me to MEPS for a physical until I met the physical standards (which I expected, that makes sense), but that they might get me in to take the SIFT earlier than that if I'm improving with my PT. Good news is I won't be taking the ASVAB again! I got a 130 GT and a 94 AFQT when I took it in 2005 and since I'm still in the military, I can use those scores. I can't believe I got a 130, I thought it was sub 120. They just put a guy in who was fresh out of high school with some civilian pilot hours, a borderline SIFT and GT score, and he made it I think in JAN, so they have some recent experience with it. Other news for others' future reference, even as prior sister service still in an active status, I will indeed have to do a new MEPS physical, and even a new SF86 even though I hold active clearance.

 

Now, off for a run!

[firepilot42]

Insanity will shed 30lbs in 60 days.

[Yamer]

Ha ha ha he said "gearing your package towards"..... Lmao

 

 

I'm really bored, sorry

[SBuzzkill]

Sounds like you're in a good position dude. I was fat as f**k when I applied too and a month later after pushups every commercial break, situps, and running intervals all the time I was a 270 on the PT test. You got this just keep the motivation up and watch a lot of Youtube videos.

[Caelus]

Thanks for the encouragement, thats good sh!t. I ran 5 miles in an hour, very slow but it's to improve my overall cardio. Nice long run keeping my heart rate at the right spot. I figure I'll take a mock PT test every week or every other week and put some interval runs and long runs in there. Hopefully the weight will start coming off and I'll get that 300+ PT score by the time I take my physical in June.

 

Ha ha ha he said "gearing your package towards"..... Lmao


I'm really bored, sorry

 

Haha... package.