15H to flying crew? Is this true?

[TriViper]

I'm looking to fly as part of the crew on Blackhawk helicopters only, but not necessarily a pilot at this time (maybe down the road). So, I'm looking to enlist first into a job working on the aircraft.

 

The only aircraft related vacancy is 15H (Pneudraulics). My recruiter said that since this job encompasses all types of aircraft (to include Chinooks, Blackhawks) it would put me in position apply as a crew member down the road. Is this true or is he just saying this? I know 15T (Blackhawk repairer) is obviously the best to become a door gunner or other flying crew, but I'm wondering if 15H will also position me well enough? Appreciate your insight.

 

 

 

 

[UH60MCE]

I'm a 15T SSG Technical Inspector and crew chief who was just selected for warrant (153A). I can tell you that 9 times out of 10 you will not crew unless you're needed while deployed, in which case you would be a door gunner, not a actual crew chief. I'd avoid 15H MOS, you're rarely needed and will be tasked out to many dull details.

[TriViper]

I'm a 15T SSG Technical Inspector and crew chief who was just selected for warrant (153A). I can tell you that 9 times out of 10 you will not crew unless you're needed while deployed, in which case you would be a door gunner, not a actual crew chief. I'd avoid 15H MOS, you're rarely needed and will be tasked out to many dull details.

 

I just want to be able to fly on the aircraft -- to me, it doesn't matter which position. Having said that, would pneudralics position me well for door gunner? I'm just trying to gage which aircraft related jobs would give me the best chance to fly on aircraft. Thanks.

[Yamer]

15T or Chinook Repairer.

 

Like mentioned above, I wouldn't pick 15H if you want to be a flying crew member.

[napoleonpp]

Like the others said 15H is not the MOST to sign up for if you wish to fly on the aircraft. I was a chinook crew member, 15U, for almost 6 years. I never even knew where the Pneudralics shop was in that time or ever saw them doing their job to begin with. I'll give the recruiter the benefit of doubt and maybe he's just mistaken, either that or trying to pull one over on you.

[mdeneso]

It is very very rare when a back shops guy gets a flight slot as a DG. The only reason I ever got one was because I was planning on reclassing to 15U after my deployment and knew the right people.

[TriViper]

So for someone who joins the Reserve/Guard (because that's what I'm looking at right now), how long would it typically take for someone to become a flying crew member once they enlist in 15T? Are we talking 3-4 years? And how often would you get to fly in the helicopter?

[napoleonpp]

I was a Active Duty 15U, chinook crewchief, so it may be slightly different. For me though, they asked me the very day I reported to maintenance as a new Private if I wanted to go to Flight Company. I jumped at the chance, cus it's what I had been wanting to do. Surprisingly hardly none of the maintenance guys wanted to actually fly, at my unit anyways.

 

I heard afew months ago they were going to be making a list of some of our 64 crew chiefs who might want to be door gunners whenever our unit manages to deploy. I wanted to put my name down I miss it so bad lol

[TriViper]

I was a Active Duty 15U, chinook crewchief, so it may be slightly different. For me though, they asked me the very day I reported to maintenance as a new Private if I wanted to go to Flight Company. I jumped at the chance, cus it's what I had been wanting to do. Surprisingly hardly none of the maintenance guys wanted to actually fly, at my unit anyways.

 

I heard afew months ago they were going to be making a list of some of our 64 crew chiefs who might want to be door gunners whenever our unit manages to deploy. I wanted to put my name down I miss it so bad lol

 

Nice. So Flight Company just means everyone who flys on the aircraft?

[TriViper]

Also, besides pilot and door gunner, what other flying crew positions are there? Thanks.

[CharyouTree]

Also, besides pilot and door gunner, what other flying crew positions are there? Thanks.

Don't confuse door gunner with crew chief.

 

It's a bit convoluted, but...

 

15T and 15U are your "crew chiefs" (or flight engineer...) Door gunners are auxiliary add-ons either from a different unit, or within; depends on how your unit wants to run things (Can be an 11B, or a 68W...whoever gets in). It's only temporary, though, through the deployment. Your permanent aircrew members are only made up of Ts, Us, and... TIs. Technical Inspectors should also be on flight orders, and meet annual and semi-annual requirements. I think they can be T, F, N, U, G, H... whoever gets those TI orders (Might have to be T/U to not be 'limited TI orders'... I don't know if they get flight status or not...)

 

Bottom line is, if you want to be non-rated aircrew, go T or U. Hours are long and hard. You have to perform MX and do your flights.

[napoleonpp]

 

Nice. So Flight Company just means everyone who flys on the aircraft?

Yes I was only in one unit before getting picked up for being a pilot. The way it was run was basically you have the basic maintenance guys in Delta Company who perform major maintenance and Phases, basically stripping the bird down and inspecting and fixing it. Then you have flight company. We were the ones that went on missions and would also usually perform small unscheduled maintenance. This is how my unit was run anyways.

 

Like the last person said though, don't confuse door gunner as a crew chief. Door Gunners is another MOS that they take on to man a gun. The crew chief is one who is trained to complete every mission task that that helicopter is capable of and able to effectively troubleshoot any maintenance issues without a problem. Luckily my unit didn't allow anyone to crew with us unless you were a crew chief, rather we were stateside or deployed. I've heard of cooks being door gunners on 47s before. I liked my unit not allowing this. I always knew all 4 of us were capable of troubleshooting any maintenance issue we may run into, and were capable of performing any mission task without even having to think about it.

 

If your goal is to crew then I would tell the recruiter that you will not sign for anything other than 15T. As long as your scores are good enough, then hold out for it.

[stearmann4]

If you actually ant to be a NRCM (non-rated crew member), 15T (Blackhawk), or 15U (Chinook) repairer are the only two MOSs that will get you there. There is the off chance you may be able to do some flying as described above, but it's not a formally tracked and trained flying position.

 

The only way other aviation MOSs can fly is to "re-classify" to a U or T. Don't let your recruiter tell you 15U or T is full, both are currently under-manned. If your follow on aspirations are to apply to WOC flying positions make it easier to build a good resume, especially if you deploy.

 

Mike-

[TriViper]

Well I'm glad I posted because I was on the verge of following my recruiter's word and enlisting in 15H. Not so much anymore.

 

Also...

 

1. What are the physical qualifications to be a non-rated crew member? Does your eyesight have to be correctable to 20/20?

 

2. Whenever a Blackhawk goes airborne, is a crew chief always on board?

 

3. Do NRCM's ever get flight pay?

 

 

I appreciate all your insight - means a lot.

[napoleonpp]

Well I'm glad I posted because I was on the verge of following my recruiter's word and enlisting in 15H. Not so much anymore.

 

Also...

 

1. What are the physical qualifications to be a non-rated crew member? Does your eyesight have to be correctable to 20/20?

 

2. Whenever a Blackhawk goes airborne, is a crew chief always on board?

 

3. Do NRCM's ever get flight pay?

 

 

I appreciate all your insight - means a lot.

I'm not sure about the eyesight question, but NRCMs do get flight pay. As Stearmann said, our unit was way undermanned.

[Velocity173]

Well I'm glad I posted because I was on the verge of following my recruiter's word and enlisting in 15H. Not so much anymore.

 

Also...

 

1. What are the physical qualifications to be a non-rated crew member? Does your eyesight have to be correctable to 20/20?

 

2. Whenever a Blackhawk goes airborne, is a crew chief always on board?

 

3. Do NRCM's ever get flight pay?

 

 

I appreciate all your insight - means a lot.

Well you have to get an annual class 3 flight physical but not sure of the standards. It's not very stringent.

 

Crew Chiefs fly based on the type mission as dictated by local SOP. Some missions require 2, some only 1 and others, none.

 

Yes you get non-rated flight pay. Last I heard it was like $150.

[TriViper]

Well you have to get an annual class 3 flight physical but not sure of the standards. It's not very stringent.

 

Crew Chiefs fly based on the type mission as dictated by local SOP. Some missions require 2, some only 1 and others, none.

 

Yes you get non-rated flight pay. Last I heard it was like $150.

 

Not that I'm complaining, but I've always been intrigued by the flight pay. Why do pilots/crew get this additional compensation?

[Velocity173]

 

Not that I'm complaining, but I've always been intrigued by the flight pay. Why do pilots/crew get this additional compensation?

Pilots get rated (ACIP) flight pay. It's at a much higher value than CEs flight pay. Another reason to apply to WOFT as a CE.

 

Flight pay is a form of hazardous duty pay. Just like jump pay, it's there as an incentive to do a job with a certain level of risk.

[Creep0321]

As well as an incentive to stay, hence the jump in pay after 6 years.

[CharyouTree]

Pilots get rated (ACIP) flight pay. It's at a much higher value than CEs flight pay. Another reason to apply to WOFT as a CE.

 

Flight pay is a form of hazardous duty pay. Just like jump pay, it's there as an incentive to do a job with a certain level of risk.

 

It's higher after 6 years... Prior to that, it will be lower than an E-6.

 

I can't remember where I saw it, but I recently read a history of ACIP, and why it came to be, how it was designed for O grades, prior to creation of the aviation branch. Was an interesting read, though I'm not sure of the accuracy, as I wasn't there. Also, it's a bit moo since I don't know where I read it. It's basically about why it's called career incentive pay, and not HDIP (for rated members)

[TriViper]

I was a Active Duty 15U, chinook crewchief, so it may be slightly different. For me though, they asked me the very day I reported to maintenance as a new Private if I wanted to go to Flight Company. I jumped at the chance, cus it's what I had been wanting to do. Surprisingly hardly none of the maintenance guys wanted to actually fly, at my unit anyways.

 

I heard afew months ago they were going to be making a list of some of our 64 crew chiefs who might want to be door gunners whenever our unit manages to deploy. I wanted to put my name down I miss it so bad lol

 

Good deal. So how long does it typically take to once you're at your unit to begin flying on the choppers (assuming you enlist in 15T)? Like 3-4 years or what?

[UH60MCE]

As a SSG I currently get $215 per month in fly pay, about $75 more than a WO1. Your vision must be correctable to 20/20 (glasses). In order to maintain fly pay as a NRCM you must fly your ATP minimums (4 hours per month). You must be able to pass a Class 3 flight physical (blood work, eyes, ears, throat and top to bottom physical).

 

Additionally, you must be able to pass a -10 test, along with other academic tests covering everything from Aeromedical to your specific airframe systems. A crew chief's job requires you to not only fix the helicopter, but diagnose and trouble shoot faults while you're flying. It's a very demanding, but rewarding job. Again, I'll reiterate, if you want to be a flying crew chief, you need to enlist as a 15T or 15U (Blackhawk maintainer/Chinook maintainer).

[napoleonpp]

 

Good deal. So how long does it typically take to once you're at your unit to begin flying on the choppers (assuming you enlist in 15T)? Like 3-4 years or what?

I had to go through afew additional schools that you would not have to attend. Without those, from Basic until the time I started the course to learn to be a crew chief was about a year, then the crew chief course I was in was about 6 months if I remember correctly.

[TriViper]

Is there such thing as a Warrant Officer crew chief?

[napoleonpp]

Is there such thing as a Warrant Officer crew chief?

No if you're going to go Warrant you will be flying, at least the ones applying on this forum will be. Otherwise will be a walking warrant as we call them.