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Hello everyone,

 

I am a civilian 28 years old wanting to put in a packet for WOFT.

I am highly motivated and dedicated to pursuing this career before I am too old.

 

But my stats are not that great... I have a GED with 8 credits. It was two 4 credit classes because I played college sports.

My ASVAB scores are in the 80s. Im currently going to get laser eye surgery to meet the standards. Ive had a misdemeanor but my recruiter has gotten me a waiver for it. Ive been studying for the SIFT test for the past 4 months so am feeling very confident in that aspect.

 

One plus that I have is that I am able to get a few LORs from a former influential congressman (A family friend,would write an in depth letter of my character), another former congressman who would attest to my character, former air force fighter pilot colonel, CW-2, CW-4.

 

My recruiter is pushing me to enlist first as a 15T and put my packet in during active duty. I am not opposed to that but I just want to go to the route that is the highest percentage for me. I am willing to do anything to become an Army aviator before it is too late.

 

Thank you for taking the time to read this and please be brutally honest with me.

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My 2 cents: dont enlist first. My recruiter told me it would be an easier path to enlist in an aviation MOS and that active duty applicants had a higher percentage selection rate. That is not a true statistic. Things may change in the time it takes to put a packet in, but the last 2 civilian boards had a 100% selection rate.

 

As for your eligibility, do your best to do awesome on your LORs, APFT, ASVAB, and SIFT!

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All signs point to "don't enlist first."

I assume that 8 credits is sufficient for Army enlistment? I know for the USMC it is 15 with a GED, not sure how uniform that is across the board.

I think as long as you are eligible on paper and can demonstrate you are intelligent the GED won't be a show stopper.

Mike

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Apply now. As said above, the past two civilian boards were 100%. 30/30 and 22/22 maybe? Anyways, this last board somebody had a GED as well. The worst thing to happen is youre not selected and you try again the following board.

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You guys are giving me hope! haha

Im going to ask my recruiter to help with a packet.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but as of right now, you don't qualify. Like mentioned above, since you have a GED you need at least 15 college credits for the WOFT program (IDK if it's still needed for a basic enlist or not). I'm surprised your recruiter didn't tell you this.

 

Look under "Basic Requirements"

http://www.usarec.army.mil/hq/warrant/prerequ/woft.shtml

 

You can find AR 601-210, 2-7c (7) here, (It's pg 7 after the roman numerals)

http://www.militaryatheists.org/regs/ArmyReg601-210v2007.pdf

 

FWIW - I also have a GED and i'm currently pursuing a degree to not only meet the requirements but also have a good back up plan incase i'm not selected or to put to use after I serve.

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Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but as of right now, you don't qualify. Like mentioned above, since you have a GED you need at least 15 college credits for the WOFT program (IDK if it's still needed for a basic enlist or not). I'm surprised your recruiter didn't tell you this.

 

Look under "Basic Requirements"

http://www.usarec.army.mil/hq/warrant/prerequ/woft.shtml

 

You can find AR 601-210, 2-7c (7) here, (It's pg 7 after the roman numerals)

http://www.militaryatheists.org/regs/ArmyReg601-210v2007.pdf

 

FWIW - I also have a GED and i'm currently pursuing a degree to not only meet the requirements but also have a good back up plan incase i'm not selected or to put to use after I serve.

Can i still submit my packet and really polish all the other sections and hope for the best? Or would I not even be allowed to submit it?

 

Ive met with warrant officers and have some good recommendations.

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It sounds like the policy is 15 credits. Full stop. I'm not certain about this, but I know for the USMC you need the credits. Period. I'd assume the army is the same.

 

Why not sign up for a couple decent community college classes, you should be able to knock them out in a couple months time? Take something relevant like low level physics or engineering.

 

Mike

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Can i still submit my packet and really polish all the other sections and hope for the best? Or would I not even be allowed to submit it?

 

Ive met with warrant officers and have some good recommendations.

 

I can't give you a direct answer on that since I'm not an Army official but my educated guess is that no, you wouldn't be allowed in the program. You could submit anything you want but without all of the listed basic requirements I highly doubt it would even be looked at much less accepted. I personally wouldn't waste my time or the time of anyone else submitting an incomplete packet.

 

You said you already have 8 college credits so at this point you only need 7 more. Like Mike said above, just go take some summer classes at your local community college (make sure its accredited) and you'll be fully qualified education wise.

 

-Richard

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  • 2 weeks later...

So basically Im going to meps next month as a 15t. Still can't get rid of the pilot bug.

My recruiter said he will help me submit a packet after ait and when im at my unit.

 

1. How long will the pilot shortage last?

2. When I submit my packet after ait, will it still matter that I dont have 15 credits?

3. Does it really matter if I go into aviation mos as I do already have a few recommendations already?

4. Will I have to extend my contract or will I get a new one if selected?

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So basically Im going to meps next month as a 15t. Still can't get rid of the pilot bug.

My recruiter said he will help me submit a packet after ait and when im at my unit.

 

1. How long will the pilot shortage last?

2. When I submit my packet after ait, will it still matter that I dont have 15 credits?

3. Does it really matter if I go into aviation mos as I do already have a few recommendations already?

4. Will I have to extend my contract or will I get a new one if selected?

If you really want to fly you need to get those credits knocked out, put in your packet as a civilian. The pick up rate is almost always 100%. If you enlist as a 15T... by the time you even have enough military experience to be competitive on the AD side you will need an age waiver lol. And I would bet a paycheck your recruiter isn't going to help you put in your packet after you enlist. Just my thoughts man, how bad do you want it? You can always enlist later if it doesn't work out.

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If you really want to fly you need to get those credits knocked out, put in your packet as a civilian. The pick up rate is almost always 100%. If you enlist as a 15T... by the time you even have enough military experience to be competitive on the AD side you will need an age waiver lol. And I would bet a paycheck your recruiter isn't going to help you put in your packet after you enlist. Just my thoughts man, how bad do you want it? You can always enlist later if it doesn't work out.

I agree 100% with RiseUpNation44. Your recruiter likely doesn't want to spend the time to put together a woft packet. I also found that all the recruiters I dealt with were completely clueless on the process. I think they honestly believed that you're more likely to get selected as AD. The selection rates don't lie. Submit your civilian WOFT packet and if you REALLY can't get selected, then enlist.

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Your chances are better for selection as a civilian but you will be a better pilot and warrant officer if you do some enlisted time first. My personal opinion is that no one should be allowed to be a warrant officer or officer prior to being a NCO but the Army doesn’t see it that way.

 

I also wouldn’t expect that recruiter to help you three or four years from now when you’re finally going to get your packet submitted. There’s a good chance he’s a DA select recruiter and only doing the job for a few years before going back to his actual MOS.

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Eh. I've known great and terrible officers prior service and not. There is a danger in imposing an NCO requirement that you lose all your good NCOs, or that you can't fill your officer ranks. That said, I think typically decent enlisted experience can't hurt, if for no other reason than to provide some perspective on what you are asking of your men, and what the end result of stupidity in the head-shed can be.

 

Mike

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Id have to disagree. They are quickly moving away from that model by reducing active federal service time allowed in the near future. According to a certain CW5 a few weeks ago all of us prior nco's are not what aviation needs. And from a manning level he is right. All my years of experience do jack for me now except help me get to retirement faster. Not to mention the saltiest of all my fellow warrants also have a healthy ammount of time as NCOs. As for the original question, that recruiter doesnt care about your career, you will actually be less likely to be selected from the enlisted ranks. Period. And you will still need the 15 credits regardless. There are no points just cuz you did a little time. Get the classes if your serious about flying as a part time job. Until you swear in at meps you can get off that train. Probably gonna have to find a new recruiter though.

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Id have to disagree. They are quickly moving away from that model by reducing active federal service time allowed in the near future. According to a certain CW5 a few weeks ago all of us prior nco's are not what aviation needs. And from a manning level he is right. All my years of experience do jack for me now except help me get to retirement faster. Not to mention the saltiest of all my fellow warrants also have a healthy ammount of time as NCOs. As for the original question, that recruiter doesnt care about your career, you will actually be less likely to be selected from the enlisted ranks. Period. And you will still need the 15 credits regardless. There are no points just cuz you did a little time. Get the classes if your serious about flying as a part time job. Until you swear in at meps you can get off that train. Probably gonna have to find a new recruiter though.

 

Ive read about something called 'High school to flight school'?

 

Highschoolers don't have college credits right? Am I missing something?

 

The reason I cant pump out the last few credits is because I currently work a full time job to pay bills and I cannot go to community college while working full. I work 12 hours a day so that I could pay for rent and necessities.

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Ive read about something called 'High school to flight school'?

 

Highschoolers don't have college credits right? Am I missing something?

 

The reason I cant pump out the last few credits is because I currently work a full time job to pay bills and I cannot go to community college while working full. I work 12 hours a day so that I could pay for rent and necessities.

I mean like I said I have really strong LOR's in my opinion, solid asvab, and continuing to study hard for the sift. Would I not even be allowed to put in a packet because I dont have 15 college credits?

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You could have cured cancer and developed a cold fusion reactor. Some things are based on black-letter policy. Period. That's how the military works.

I don't think anyone is doubting your drive or intelligence, or suggesting it's not bad policy to always require 15 credits, period. But that seems to be the case here, so operate under that assumption. The summer semester starts soon and runs quick. Sign up for another 7-8 credits and you'll have them done a couple months from now. It might be painful given your work schedule, but I'm confident if you want this you can make it work.

 

Mike

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You could have cured cancer and developed a cold fusion reactor. Some things are based on black-letter policy. Period. That's how the military works.

 

I don't think anyone is doubting your drive or intelligence, or suggesting it's not bad policy to always require 15 credits, period. But that seems to be the case here, so operate under that assumption. The summer semester starts soon and runs quick. Sign up for another 7-8 credits and you'll have them done a couple months from now. It might be painful given your work schedule, but I'm confident if you want this you can make it work.

 

Mike

There is no requirement for ANY college credits for the Warrant Officer Flight Training program. All an applicant needs is a high school diploma or I assume a GED. I was just selected in the March board with nothing more than my high school diploma.
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I mean like I said I have really strong LOR's in my opinion, solid asvab, and continuing to study hard for the sift. Would I not even be allowed to put in a packet because I dont have 15 college credits?

 

You're not missing anything. I was just selected with a high school diploma and no college credits whatsoever.

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So I guess there's the answer. Question: Did this ever come up? USAREC website seems to say different, unless I missed something.

I think the 15 credit requirement (which I guess only applies to other services) is dumb, so glad to see it doesn't apply.

Mike

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The confusion is that the Army looks at a high school diploma and a GED separately. Here's a link to the USAREC page: http://www.usarec.army.mil/hq/warrant/prerequ/woft.shtml. It states that you need a high school diploma. If you have a GED, you need enough college credits to meet education code "128", and it quotes AR 601-210, 2-7c(7).

 

Here's a link to that regulation: https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/pdf/web/ARN6642_AR601-210_ADMIN_WEB_Final.pdf.

 

The applicable language is on pages 9-10.

 

The section they quote states that for GED holders, you need 15 semester credits, 22 quarter hours, or 675 clock hours of classroom time from an accredited post-secondary institution in order to meet the same education requirement as a high school diploma holder.

 

This requirement might be waiverable, but I don't have any info on that.

 

Not trying to bring you down, I just wanted to make sure that you had all the correct information!

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The confusion is that the Army looks at a high school diploma and a GED separately. Here's a link to the USAREC page: http://www.usarec.army.mil/hq/warrant/prerequ/woft.shtml. It states that you need a high school diploma. If you have a GED, you need enough college credits to meet education code "128", and it quotes AR 601-210, 2-7c(7).

 

Here's a link to that regulation: https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/pdf/web/ARN6642_AR601-210_ADMIN_WEB_Final.pdf.

 

The applicable language is on pages 9-10.

 

The section they quote states that for GED holders, you need 15 semester credits, 22 quarter hours, or 675 clock hours of classroom time from an accredited post-secondary institution in order to meet the same education requirement as a high school diploma holder.

 

This requirement might be waiverable, but I don't have any info on that.

 

Not trying to bring you down, I just wanted to make sure that you had all the correct information!

My bad, Wolf. Thanks for the clarification. I didn't figure the Army treated GED's different than high school diplomas. I guess that's why they call it "High School to Flight School" and not "High School or GED to Flight School" haha. Sorry for the confusion.

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