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Question for you turbine pilots(67 Nov, Delorean, Flingwing, etc...you know who you are :) )

 

I know the hobbs works only in the 22/44 as soon as you start the helicopter, and that's the total time(TT) you can log at the end of your flight. I thought that the hobbs only works, when you pull collective on most turbines(or is that engine hobbs, vs airframe hobbs??)? Is this true? Are you logging TT for duration of flight ONLY, or are you logging TT of what's on the hobbs for that engine start? Engine running, on the ground, your at the controls....YOU are the acting PIC, so can you log that time, as well?

 

Thanks in advance-

R91

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Most of the turbine helicopters I've flown don't have Hobbs meter. How do we keep track of time? By writing it down, my watch works just fine. :)

 

That is how the maintenance logs are kept as well.

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I fly an Alouette II occasionally. It has two, count them two, hobbs meters. One is collective while the other is engine. The two, as it has been told to me, are for engine time and life limited part time. While the engine is on and the blades are spinning, the blades aren't actually doing anything thus not logging hours towards their time out.

 

Again this is how it has been explained to me. Forgive me if I don't have the whole story.

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It has two, count them two, hobbs meters. One is collective while the other is engine. The two, as it has been told to me, are for engine time and life limited part time. While the engine is on and the blades are spinning, the blades aren't actually doing anything thus not logging hours towards their time out.

Again this is how it has been explained to me. Forgive me if I don't have the whole story.

 

Hey NB I was waiting for someone to post on this. Turbines (at least in the Mil) have engine hobbs (civil mod may/should have) , because they have a longer start up and shut down cycle than the airframe, as with most engines they need a cool down period.

 

engines and airframes are usually very close together, but engines are by nature needing more attention to detail because of the life span.

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Most civy turbines will only have a collective hobbs...how do the pilots log it? Well that varies. Some log ground time, some just write down the collective hobbs. Me personally I just write down the collective hobbs. In two years of flying turbines I probably would only have gained another 100-200 hours if I was lucky but then if the FAA for some reason looks at my logbooks they will wonder why the maintenance time doesnt match my log time. But the way I do it everything matches. 135 duty log-log book-maintenance...so try and bust me now you *#@$(# #(&$(#**s

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Rotor- Hey Rob, I could swear that an R44 I was checking out uses a collective driven hobbs. I realize its not a turbine ( well....not yet ) but I wanted to ask if the R44 comes standard with a collective hobbs, or if its an option of some sort ??? any one know?

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R22 comes with a oil pressure switch hobbs, R44 with a oil pressure w/ collective-up hobbs. Their life-limited component times run off those times respectfully.

 

You can convert the R22 Hobbs to the collective Hobbs, BUT you need to multiply all the times by a certian factor listed in the mx manual (around 1.2 or something). If you do a TON of autos or are frequently running collective down (more than ~20% of the time) this might be a good option to get some extra hours out of the helicopter.

 

On the R44, you may have the regular oil-pressure Hobbs, BUT, look under the seat and you may find the collective driven one. We used to have two Hobbs on ours--one for billing, one for mx. Look on the Hobbs to see if it says "Collective Activated".

 

On our 206Ls, we have a collective driven Hobbs for the life limited components, but that's NOT how we record flight time. Flight time is defined in our ops specs as "Block to Block" as per the pilot's [breitling] watch. We have to log the times for each leg, then add them up at the end of the flight. It should add up to whatever the Hobbs is, unless you've been doing autos or Hobbs was between numbers and clicked over. That's the time that goes on the dispatch trip ticket and in your logbook. At the end of the day, you subtract the old Hobbs time from the new Hobbs time, to get the hours to add to the airframe & engine total times.

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Aw the HOBBS - there are usually two: collective and pressure. The collective is for logging time (ie when the collective is moved) and the pressure (commonly called the maint hobbs) is used for total time while the system is operating not neccessarily flying. Also used as a comparison to insure the pilots are not sitting on the ground idling (this is a check and balance and is $$ driven. Remember fuel burns whether you fly or not

Now for the individual that state his turbine aircraf doe not have a HOBBS. Hmmmmm I find it hard to believe (except the restricted - ie ex.military version, then it doe not apply but then again who cares).

All contracts with OAS and USFS, etc including FAA Part 135 requires the HOBBS as a source of logging time for compensation.

In a nutshell is to make sure the pilot is not pencil whipping his logbook. For the operator it is a revenue source.

REMEMBER THE HOBBS CAN BE YOUR FRIEND OR YOUR ENEMY

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Rotor- Hey Rob, I could swear that an R44 I was checking out uses a collective driven hobbs. I realize its not a turbine ( well....not yet ) but I wanted to ask if the R44 comes standard with a collective hobbs, or if its an option of some sort ??? any one know?

The Raven II Hobbs starts counting when you pull pitch. I'm not sure about R44-1's. R22's start timing when you have oil pressure.

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The maintenance Hobbs is the collective Hobbs. If you are doing maintenance off the oil pressure Hobbs, you are losing hours off your life-limited parts everytime you ground idle or do an auto.

 

The third variation of these are the weight-on-wheels (squat) switchs

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