The rumor mill is turning

[PhotoFlyer]

I took a look at the SCAB list... I noticed that there were SSN's or at least partial SSN's listed... Couldn't that be a violation of privacy? Just a thought... and a different topic.. BUT more importantly, LOCAL 108's, I am with you! Stand strong. You are in my thoughts!

 

A list like that could be turned into a really strong defamation suit. I didn't notice anybody taking credit for producing the list, but I wouldn't want to be involved in that legal battle.

 

I would also like to renew my original question; Is PHI hiring 600 hour pilots?

 

I am not looking for a job, as I have no desire to work in the GOM. I have read various accounts about the number of pilots on strike, and think that if they lowered their minimum hours, that would be a good indication that the higher numbers (90% plus) are on strike. Each party involved will put their own spin on the numbers released, and I am curious which is more accurate.

[Gomer Pylot]

There have been several suits brought by scabs against use of the list, and in every case they have been dismissed. As long as it can be shown that the individual did cross a picket line, they have no legal basis to sue, since there are numerous legal precedents already in place. The term scab has a long history, is in the dictionaries, and telling the truth is not defamation.

[Voluptuary5]

I don't think Photo was talking about the list itself but rather the publishing of thier SSN's.

 

Don't know anything about the 600 hour rumor.

 

-V5

[Gomer Pylot]

If you do a Google search, you'll find that that list has been the subject of lawsuits, and all were dismissed.

[klas]

If you do a Google search, you'll find that that list has been the subject of lawsuits, and all were dismissed.

 

 

I only found a couple - one dismissed because the party didn't respond in time, and another because the party suing the union couldn't claim injury from an industry as a whole, he had to claim injury from an particular co. Sounds like all that has to happen is someone to prove that he/she was blacklisted because of the list by one of the cos. and they will have a case.

 

Any lawsuits answer the partial publication of the SSN's??

 

(I'm not a professional pilot, just fly for fun so I don't have an interest other than the interest in the ability of a union to blacklist ..... Didn't we deal with blacklists in the 50's??).

[Gerhardt]

the blacklist of the 50s is nothing like the list of scabs being referenced here.

[klas]

the blacklist of the 50s is nothing like the list of scabs being referenced here.

 

Oh okay.

 

If the intention is to stop people from working at places, it is the same.

[Gomer Pylot]

The scab list doesn't stop people from working. ALPA doesn't have the power to dictate who airlines can hire.

[bossman]

The scab list doesn't stop people from working. ALPA doesn't have the power to dictate who airlines can hire.

Gomer,

Your synical attitude never ceases to amaze me. You don't hire or fire a man or woman because their name is not on a list. The NLRB has many cases where jobs and back pay were issued because some tried to "black ball" an individual.

Bossman

[jet trash]

The scab list doesn't stop people from working. ALPA doesn't have the power to dictate who airlines can hire.

 

very true. in fact, the DO of our airline is on that list. and he is an active ALPA member! go figure.

[Gerhardt]

Not to change the subject of the thread but not once have I noticed Gomer having a cynical attitude. He's always been helpful to low-timers like me. If you disagree with something he's said feel free to say so and then state your case on why you think he's wrong. No need for personal attacks.

[Scout449]

This has been interesting. Like CFISD I have been intested in phi.

so I have been following this for a while and am still confused.

like all battles, what is the real truth and what is bs.

 

What I have not seen yet is, What did the phi Pilots start out looking for? and what part of this is the unions agenda?

 

Why did they really walk out? didnt they reject phi's offer? and now they just want it retro active? which phi already offered?

 

so having read the bs of both sides. I still am confused

 

as to the link. more b.s.

"please dont take our horrible jobs"

 

I ve seen the same bs working for a state.

 

 

 

one more comment.

 

you guys think phi is bad. take a good hard look at Delta!

 

I bet jet trash knows what I mean.

 

management RAPED that company and it employees

[KMWK]

Bottom line......if the pilots stick to their guns on this it's good for everyone in the industry. For those of you that are looking for that first job in turbines, Era is still in need of pilots. PM me if you want more info.

 

[klas]

The scab list doesn't stop people from working. ALPA doesn't have the power to dictate who airlines can hire.

 

Of course, but then why bother having a list?

[GLSNightPilot]

The strike is mainly about one thing - the existence of the union. PHI refused to bargain on anything, during the entire 3 years of negotiations. It refused to continue the agency shop provisions, which are essential to the union continuing. Retroactive pay is also essential, because otherwise the company is free to simply stall negotiations for years, at the end of every contract. This contract ended in June 2004, and the company has refused to budge on any issue for the entire time of the negotiations.

 

Purely and simply, this is about the survival of the union. It's about whether we go back to the old days of being forced to do whatever the company said, at its whim. No orderly system for upgrades and pay raises, the sick leave and vacation we accumulated over the years gone without any recompense, and on and on. Al Gonsoulin apparently bought the company with the intent of getting rid of the union, and he's spent somewhere in the tens of millions of dollars already on this, and spending more. The scabs are now being paid a bonus of $1000/day to get them to keep working.

 

The scab list is there because after any strike, there is animosity between the strikers and the scabs. This never, ever goes away. Talk to an airline captain with an ALPA pin with a star on it if you want details. Scabs may still work, but the strikers will not socialize with them, eat with them, drink with them, or even acknowledge that they exist. It isn't necessary for most to carry the list these days, because it's been awhile since a strike, and the scabs are known. However, ALPA has reportedly agreed to add the PHI strikers to the list, so there wil be a couple of hundred new additions soon. Not that it matters that much, because most of them are EMS pilots who only fly small ships and likely won't do much jumpseating, but it's the principle of the thing. If I do fly with a scab, the only thing on the CVR will be checklists, nothing else.

[jet trash]

The strike is mainly about one thing - the existence of the union. PHI refused to bargain on anything, during the entire 3 years of negotiations. It refused to continue the agency shop provisions, which are essential to the union continuing. Retroactive pay is also essential, because otherwise the company is free to simply stall negotiations for years, at the end of every contract. This contract ended in June 2004, and the company has refused to budge on any issue for the entire time of the negotiations.

 

Purely and simply, this is about the survival of the union. It's about whether we go back to the old days of being forced to do whatever the company said, at its whim. No orderly system for upgrades and pay raises, the sick leave and vacation we accumulated over the years gone without any recompense, and on and on. Al Gonsoulin apparently bought the company with the intent of getting rid of the union, and he's spent somewhere in the tens of millions of dollars already on this, and spending more. The scabs are now being paid a bonus of $1000/day to get them to keep working.

 

The scab list is there because after any strike, there is animosity between the strikers and the scabs. This never, ever goes away. Talk to an airline captain with an ALPA pin with a star on it if you want details. Scabs may still work, but the strikers will not socialize with them, eat with them, drink with them, or even acknowledge that they exist. It isn't necessary for most to carry the list these days, because it's been awhile since a strike, and the scabs are known. However, ALPA has reportedly agreed to add the PHI strikers to the list, so there wil be a couple of hundred new additions soon. Not that it matters that much, because most of them are EMS pilots who only fly small ships and likely won't do much jumpseating, but it's the principle of the thing. If I do fly with a scab, the only thing on the CVR will be checklists, nothing else.

 

Your quote "However, ALPA has reportedly agreed to add the PHI strikers to the list, so there wil be a couple of hundred new additions soon" doesn't really hold water. ALPA doesn't have a "scab" list and never has. The so called "Scab List" was produced by various pilots from striking carriers and has never been acknowledged by ALPA.

[GLSNightPilot]

Then what do you make of this legal case?

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getc.../975587man.html

[jet trash]

Then what do you make of this legal case?

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getc.../975587man.html

 

It alleges ALPA made the scablist, but in reality the list was compiled by EAL MEC.

 

Go to ALPA.org and call the national headquaters in Hearndon, VA. Ask for a copy of the "scablist" and see what the answer is.

[Linc]

This has been interesting. Like CFISD I have been intested in phi.

so I have been following this for a while and am still confused.

like all battles, what is the real truth and what is bs.

 

What I have not seen yet is, What did the phi Pilots start out looking for? and what part of this is the unions agenda?

 

Why did they really walk out? didnt they reject phi's offer? and now they just want it retro active? which phi already offered?

 

so having read the bs of both sides. I still am confused

 

as to the link. more b.s.

"please dont take our horrible jobs"

 

I ve seen the same bs working for a state.

one more comment.

 

you guys think phi is bad. take a good hard look at Delta!

 

I bet jet trash knows what I mean.

 

management RAPED that company and it employees

Scout,

 

I can't describe how calloused and uninformed your response appears to me. I saw nothing on that link that didn't agree with everything that I have ever heard about PHI, from pilots who worked within the company; some of whom even had a hand in the formation of Local 108.

[klas]

Looks like some pilots are going back to work:

 

http://www.acadiananow.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...=73259242176225

[garvey]

I work on an oil rig that PHI is supposed to be transporting us back and forth............ What about us!? I understand a strike but we are getting f*cked over too............WTF ! I also can not see how you can attack an EMS pilot............ they are actually doing a life and death job...........if some body dies is that worth the retro pay?..........Just my thoughts

[Linc]

Ask the company the same thing. They'll probably tell you that there has been only minor disruption in service. I'm sure they have quite a few scabs, people who aren't tied in, who don't have information about the company, but have heard through the grapevine that the company is a great way to build time. Time was how you got the good paying jobs. Corporates, they want and can choose very experienced pilots for their aviation units, and they pay them nicely, but is that even enough for a specialized skill that provides safety and convenience? As long as helicopter pilots want to fly for peanuts, which is the history of PHI with their pilots, don't give this strike any credibility, cross the picket line and work for PHI.

 

The majority of complaints I've heard/seen come from people with no knowledge of the history of how PHI treats and has treated its pilots. How they have fought having this union for years, because they knew that the union would force them to pay pilots what they're worth, and not what the company wants to pay them.

 

Link 1, Link 2, Link 3, Link 4 and Link 5 (Links are not in chronological order, unless I got extremely lucky. In which case, you don't know me very well.)

 

rec.aviation.rotorcraft is a newsgroup I hung out on before web forums became popular. It was how I first learned about conditions inside the company after hearing my pilots talk about PHI, before I became a pilot myself.

[C of G]

I work on an oil rig that PHI is supposed to be transporting us back and forth............ What about us!? I understand a strike but we are getting f*cked over too............WTF ! I also can not see how you can attack an EMS pilot............ they are actually doing a life and death job...........if some body dies is that worth the retro pay?..........Just my thoughts

 

Just outta curiosity, what rig are you working on and how far out are you at the moment? What type of work are you doing?

[GLSNightPilot]

Garvey, if you're not happy, then have your company tell PHI about it. The more pressure the customers put on PHI, the quicker this will be over. As for EMS, there is far more competition there than in the Gulf of Mexico. There are always other EMS air ambulances available, and nobody is going to die. The only result will be loss of revenue. The strike isn't really about retro pay, it's about the existence of the union, and a collective bargaining agreement. PHI refuses to allow the existence of the union, and has not bargained on a single issue in more than 3 years. In fact, the union agreed to accept the company's offer on retro pay, and the company immediately said, "Oh no, we didn't really mean that". PHI took away our accured sick leave, most vacation, in addition to the pay. Money is not the issue, never has been, and PHI has spent many, many times the amount it would have cost to agree to the union's first proposal.

[Wally]

I work on an oil rig that PHI is supposed to be transporting us back and forth............ What about us!? I understand a strike but we are getting f*cked over too............WTF ! I also can not see how you can attack an EMS pilot............ they are actually doing a life and death job...........if some body dies is that worth the retro pay?..........Just my thoughts

 

I'm not a PHI hand anymore, but I'll tell you something I believe completely- The strikers would rather be flying, period. When I was in the GoM, every minute I wasn't in the cockpit was a loss. PHI's a contracter, and they've agreed to provide a service. The pilots would be flying if they could, but ther're not going to produce income for a company that's intent on taking advantage of them. Busting the union, or whatever you want to call the intent of PHI management, serves no purpose other than making the pilots "at will", PERIOD.

As to the EMS side, ditto, caps, bold and underlined. I am an EMSer, and I'm there to fly.