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hello all,

Just a quick question for all the other 300 drivers out there. What pattern altitude does your school use and for what reason for regular/steep app, st in and 180 autos ?

 

 

Let's see here.

 

Traffic patterns for basic approaches and what not, 300' AGl turn crosswind, 500'AGL turn downwind, turn base and go to 300'AGL by the time you turn final. Intercept your normal, shallow and steep angles from 300' AGL.

 

Autos are a bit different. When I did my training I did all of them from 500'AGL and 70knots for the entry. This included the 180 autos. Now, when I became a CFI, I started my students out higher. Why? Well there was more time to talk about what I was doing and for them to see what was going on. So I did them from 700'AGL. Then I would work them down to 500'AGL.

 

For advanced students I would do autos at night from 700'AGL . I would also do autos from 300'AGL as to simulate an engine failure on final. Also, I would demonstrate autos while in a hover taxi from 3'AGL. Lastly, we may do some autos from 700'AGL and enter with no airspeed(from OGE Hover).

 

That was what I did. However, I made sure I had the training and was comfortable doing these autos. The more complicated you make it the bigger the chance for something to go wrong. Keep that in mind. If you are a new CFI I would stick with doing them from 500'-700'AGl and 70knts for the entry. This is how all CFIs should do it unless "checked out" or approved by their Chief Pilot. That's my opinion.

 

 

JD

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I'm a 300 jockey and our pattern is 600 ft, but it is defined by the airport. Concord, CA uses 600' but in Napa it's 500' When you're doing auto's, steep approaches, etc (which is what I was doing about an hour ago) you want to allow as much time for making decisions as possible, So I enter as high as I can possibly get away with. Hope this answers.....

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Pattern Alt = 500agl

straight in auto = 500agl

180 auto = 800agl

takeoff auto = min 150 agl and 60 knts

OGE auto = 800agl

 

now steep approaches, in training its 300 agl set up, 200 agl and 40 knots, but only in training, the intent outside of the pattern (ie on a real off airport) is to minimize the exposed time and come in as normal as possible. The only reason to set up 300agl is to allow for time for the student to learn.

 

edit:: I agree with the below posters regarding initial autos, ours are conducted at 1500-2000 agl at a minimum, usually with a gradual introduction from a decent into the auto so there is very little time spent where a new student would feel like s/he was falling out of control

Edited by aclark79
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Autos are a bit different. When I did my training I did all of them from 500'AGL and 70knots for the entry. This included the 180 autos. Now, when I became a CFI, I started my students out higher. Why? Well there was more time to talk about what I was doing and for them to see what was going on. So I did them from 700'AGL. Then I would work them down to 500'AGL.

 

Starting out higher is a great idea. My first one was 500'AGL, and I screwed it up bad. Next flight, we went up in the hills, and on the way back, I climbed up to 2000'AGL and told my instructor that we're going to auto up here. He asked why, and my reply was so that I could get the feel for it and not have to rush it like the last flight. So, we entered and after chasing the rotor for a thousand feet, I started to get the feel. It helped for the entries, but not the flare or recovery. That part took longer to master.

 

I'm slow.

 

In the meantime, may I suggest the first couple of autos be demonstrated from a greater altitude?

 

Later

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Starting out higher is a great idea. My first one was 500'AGL, and I screwed it up bad. Next flight, we went up in the hills, and on the way back, I climbed up to 2000'AGL and told my instructor that we're going to auto up here. He asked why, and my reply was so that I could get the feel for it and not have to rush it like the last flight. So, we entered and after chasing the rotor for a thousand feet, I started to get the feel. It helped for the entries, but not the flare or recovery. That part took longer to master.

 

I'm slow.

 

In the meantime, may I suggest the first couple of autos be demonstrated from a greater altitude?

 

Later

 

I've never understood why more CFI's don't do initial auto training from higher altitude. From 500' it's all pretty quick and a new student just doesn't really have time to figure out what's going on, let alone master the basics of the glide, see how the aircraft responds to different inputs, etc. I agree, start em off high, give students a better chance to stabilize things and make it more comfortable instead of just chasing RPM and wondering what just happened.

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