Make me SIC

[NorCalHeliKid]

For some time now I have been looking for answers to a question that I feel not many people are asking. So, I pose this query in hopes that somene has a legitimate answer with specific details as to who, what where and why. My eventual goal in this advetureis to be involved in heavy lift/ fire helicopters as that is where my love first started. As I see it the way to get my foot into this high security door is to get on as SIC and work my way up hopeing not to get pigeon holed into bieng stuck in sic or 10 years... it seems most people I ask who are in this position feel that I am gunning for thier job and dont feel like giving me a legitimate answer. What kind of hours are the operators of these heavy ships looking for in a SIC position? (Evergreen, Carson, Siller Bros etc) I have yet to see these positions advertised and phone calls and emails are yet to get me anywhere. Thanks for advice and input in advance. Where do I start when it comes to going after these positions?

[adam32]

For some time now I have been looking for answers to a question that I feel not many people are asking. So, I pose this query in hopes that somene has a legitimate answer with specific details as to who, what where and why. My eventual goal in this advetureis to be involved in heavy lift/ fire helicopters as that is where my love first started. As I see it the way to get my foot into this high security door is to get on as SIC and work my way up hopeing not to get pigeon holed into bieng stuck in sic or 10 years... it seems most people I ask who are in this position feel that I am gunning for thier job and dont feel like giving me a legitimate answer. What kind of hours are the operators of these heavy ships looking for in a SIC position? (Evergreen, Carson, Siller Bros etc) I have yet to see these positions advertised and phone calls and emails are yet to get me anywhere. Thanks for advice and input in advance. Where do I start when it comes to going after these positions?

 

 

Carson pilots average about 10,000 hours and they hire high time SIC pilots to train to be Captains. E-mail Erickson and they will send you a file about how they hire. You might check out FireHawk or Columbia, they hire low-time SIC's every once in a while.

[spencer]

For some time now I have been looking for answers to a question that I feel not many people are asking. So, I pose this query in hopes that somene has a legitimate answer with specific details as to who, what where and why. My eventual goal in this advetureis to be involved in heavy lift/ fire helicopters as that is where my love first started. As I see it the way to get my foot into this high security door is to get on as SIC and work my way up hopeing not to get pigeon holed into bieng stuck in sic or 10 years... it seems most people I ask who are in this position feel that I am gunning for thier job and dont feel like giving me a legitimate answer. What kind of hours are the operators of these heavy ships looking for in a SIC position? (Evergreen, Carson, Siller Bros etc) I have yet to see these positions advertised and phone calls and emails are yet to get me anywhere. Thanks for advice and input in advance. Where do I start when it comes to going after these positions?

 

 

sent you a message on a possible lead.

[Goldy]

I have yet to see these positions advertised and phone calls and emails are yet to get me anywhere. Thanks for advice and input in advance. Where do I start when it comes to going after these positions?

 

And why were you not at HAI, where they not only asked this question, they gave specific answers and had a employment fair to boot where you could apply !

 

However, based on what I heard from some pilots that had done it....SIC is a great way in, and I second the opinion..call Erickson.

 

Goldy

[mechanic]

And why were you not at HAI, where they not only asked this question, they gave specific answers and had a employment fair to boot where you could apply !

 

However, based on what I heard from some pilots that had done it....SIC is a great way in, and I second the opinion..call Erickson.

 

Goldy

 

Goldy,

Were you at the Mentoring program? I was on the left side, second row on the far left side, tan shirt with blue vertical stripes and blue sport slacks, and of course the white Heli Expo bag, LOL. I looked around but didn't recognize anyone from VR pics.

 

I did put a resume' in with Bristow/Airlog for the maint shop at the job fair after the mentorship program, waiting to see if I get a call.

 

Later

[adam32]

This is from Erickson,

 

 

 

A brief explanation of how to become a helicopter pilot employed by EAC.

 

The Human Resources department at EAC frequently receives inquiries from individuals at various levels of helicopter experience asking, “How do I become an Aircrane pilot for your company”? This writing will attempt to answer that question.

 

Erickson Air-Crane is what is referred to in the helicopter industry as a “high end” operator. That is, EAC operates only large complicated helicopters, and therefore employ only pilots with extensive aviation experience. A company that has a varied fleet of helicopters can hire a pilot with little experience to begin duties in a smaller, less costly or demanding aircraft, and move that pilot up to more complex aircraft as experience is gained. EAC, however, does not have that capability, and therefore must rely on pilots who have gained that experience elsewhere. We will discuss the various methods by which pilots can gain that experience before applying for employment at EAC.

 

First, what about a person who has no helicopter pilot training or experience at all? There are generally three avenues to get started. One is through civil flight training schools, another is through military duty, and a third is training provided by an independent Certified Flight Instructor.

Civil flight training schools are located throughout the country, and offer a variety of training courses from the basic private pilot license through the highest level of pilot ratings. The Internet, aviation magazines, or the nearest FAA office can provide names and locations of helicopter pilot training schools. The cost of training is related to the level of licensing attained, and varies greatly between schools.

Military duty during the Viet Nam era provided helicopter pilot training for the majority of pilots who are currently nearing retirement age. For the individual who has the personality to fit into military structured conditions and assignments, this is an appealing option. It is typical to see an eight years of duty to acquire the flight time necessary to find employment as a civil helicopter pilot.

The less frequently used method of training is by working directly with an instructor who is not associated with a school. A Certified Flight Instructor can provide the required training, verify completion of required flight experience, and assist in scheduling the FAA evaluations to attain licensing. This method is normally seen when a person either owns, or has access to a helicopter for the required flight training.

 

As in many occupations that require having a specific license prior to employment, having a pilot’s license is sometimes referred to as “having a license to learn.” The first job as a helicopter pilot will most likely be “entry level”, the least desirable and the lowest paying. As a pilot gains more flight time, work experience, and has the opportunity to “prove” their abilities, more desirable and higher paying jobs will become available. This advancement normally follows the associated path of flying small “light”, 4 or 5 passenger helicopters initially. With experience, moving up to “medium” aircraft capable of 10 to 12 passengers, and finally the “heavy” helicopters. In addition to the number of passengers carried, helicopters are also defined by the “gross weight” or maximum weight that can be carried. Thereby, the Aircrane, which carries no passengers, but can carry up to 25,000 lbs. of cargo is considered a “heavy.”

So what about the pilot who has been in the business for, say five years or so, and has flown a variety of makes and models of helicopters. How does that person land a job at EAC? The first requirement is that there be a need, or “vacancy” to be filled. One of the understandable facts of employment at EAC is that there is very little “turnover.” However, there are occasional openings that do not require experience in an S-64. The pilot with the specific ambition to land a job with EAC should be preparing by gaining experience in external load operations, fire-fighting operations, or a combination of the two. Even though the experience may be in an aircraft smaller than the S-64, the familiarity with the operations would be essential in considering employment without experience in a larger helicopter.

 

Finally, we’ll discuss the pilot who has been performing duties in a helicopter of size similar to the S-64. Examples would be the Super Puma, Vertol, Chinook, or the one considered the closest in systems and characteristics, the S-61. When a pilot has attained this point in their career, we focus on attributes other than ratings, flight time, and experience. In this situation, we look much more closely at the individual’s personal characteristics and personality. In this situation, a newly hired pilot may have more experience than those he or she is assigned to work with, and we need assurance that the new pilot will profess and display the attitudes that will continue EAC’s safety culture.

 

In summation, a pilot at any level who is sincerely interested in being employed by EAC must develop their professional abilities in the specific areas discussed earlier. Since the S-64 is utilized almost exclusively in two areas of helicopter operations, it is imperative to build experience in external loads or fire-fighting operations. Helicopters of all sizes are utilized in these areas, and therefore it is not necessary to wait until advancement has placed a pilot in a medium or heavy helicopter to seek these opportunities.

 

 

Minimum Qualifications for Pilots to be considered for employment:

 

1. FAA Commercial (or higher) Helicopter certificate

2. Class II (or higher) Medical

3. Have logged a minimum of 2500 hours total helicopter flight time- 1,500 hours in helicopters as pilot-in-command flight time – 500 hours must be turbine engine equipped helicopters.

 

Additionally desirable experience:

 

1. Vertical reference external loads.

2. Wildland fire-fighting.

3. Training or experience in multi-pilot crew coordination.

Edited February 27, 2008 by adam32

[Paisley]

They forgot to add that you need to be able to make it through a one hour ride without throwing up due to the helicopter wanting to vibrate/shake you to death.

[NorCalHeliKid]

And why were you not at HAI, where they not only asked this question, they gave specific answers and had a employment fair to boot where you could apply !

 

However, based on what I heard from some pilots that had done it....SIC is a great way in, and I second the opinion..call Erickson.

 

Goldy

I wish I had the money to be there...before I knew that they had a talk about this....now Im figuring out the easiest possible way to kick myself real hard. Thanks everyone for all the awesome information. Next year I'm gonna start a "Send me to the Expo" cup.

Edited February 27, 2008 by NorCalHeliKid

[mechanic]

I wish I had the money to be there...before I knew that they had a talk about this....now Im figuring out the easiest possible way to kick myself real hard. Thanks everyone for all the awesome information. Next year I'm gonna start a "Send me to the Expo" cup.

 

The lady on the panel from Evergreen got SIC in heavy's longlinen logs up in the NW around 250hrs if I understood her correct. She says that most SIC jobs hire around 500-600 hrs. She recommended this route because of the high time capt's you would be flying with and learning heli systems from if you pay attention and not just be a sand bag in the rh seat, hince the term sand baggers for new SIC's, asleep in the right seat.

 

P.S. Heli Expo is in CA next year, so you won't have to save too much, lol....

[NorCalHeliKid]

The lady on the panel from Evergreen got SIC in heavy's longlinen logs up in the NW around 250hrs if I understood her correct. She says that most SIC jobs hire around 500-600 hrs. She recommended this route because of the high time capt's you would be flying with and learning heli systems from if you pay attention and not just be a sand bag in the rh seat, hince the term sand baggers for new SIC's, asleep in the right seat.

 

P.S. Heli Expo is in CA next year, so you won't have to save too much, lol....

 

Thanks Mech, Ill be there next year...and I would never sand bag... know what the negative connotations that come with bieng "one of those"....and Im not gonna be one. Typically "baggers" as we called them are the guys who come in and try to claim your line, but wind up mopping up your fire. Wait a minute, did getting dumped on and wanting to be the guy doing the dumping make ME one?

[mrjibbs]

This may be a dumb question, but what is the best way, or best place to search for SIC positions?

[aclark79]

Excellent question, anyone actually know anyone who works as an SIC, all those fabled SIC position in the gulf for 500 hour pilots.. anyone actually get any of those....?

[C of G]

Just something to consider.... a few years back a friend of mine was going to take an SIC position with about 700 hours or so. He thought better of it on the premise that if he didn't like the work or it didn't work out for whatever reason, he would be stuck as he didn't meet other job descriptions without 1000 hours PIC. As an SIC logging PIC time can be quite a chore and be few and far between. Another friend went in with over 1000hrs and he progressed from SIC to PIC in a 500 very quickly, and is now PIC in a Vertol and loves his job.

[choppedair]

Excellent question, anyone actually know anyone who works as an SIC, all those fabled SIC position in the gulf for 500 hour pilots.. anyone actually get any of those....?

 

We have a CFII student right now (just in for a II checkride) who is employed at PHI, and was picked up with 500 hours due to a contract requirement for 2 pilots.

It's not exactly SIC, but the other pilot on her contract lets her fly most of the time.

I don't know how she came about the job, but I'll ask if I get the chance.