I'm Going Airplane

[Witch]

Now don't freak out, I'm still working on the Commercial Helicopter thingy. One of the more seasoned instructors was suggesting that I get an airplane rating. The brainworking here is that I can get the insrtument part done quite a bit cheaper and it also counts for PIC time in "powered aircraft".

 

Part of that option is that I may be able to fly via the community college where my spousal unit works. Therefore, tuition is free. Flight time and fees still apply.

 

So, I'm looking into maybe doing that and also fulfilling the helicopter requirements for the commercial rating. I'll still need at least 35 hours and a bit of night flying for that, but if flying the plane costs two thirds less, then I'm going to seriously look into it.

 

So then, have any of ya'll done, or know someone who has done, something like this?

 

Later

[rick1128]

Now don't freak out, I'm still working on the Commercial Helicopter thingy. One of the more seasoned instructors was suggesting that I get an airplane rating. The brainworking here is that I can get the insrtument part done quite a bit cheaper and it also counts for PIC time in "powered aircraft".

 

Part of that option is that I may be able to fly via the community college where my spousal unit works. Therefore, tuition is free. Flight time and fees still apply.

 

So, I'm looking into maybe doing that and also fulfilling the helicopter requirements for the commercial rating. I'll still need at least 35 hours and a bit of night flying for that, but if flying the plane costs two thirds less, then I'm going to seriously look into it.

 

So then, have any of ya'll done, or know someone who has done, something like this?

 

Later

 

Keep in mind that helicopter employers are really only interested in helicopter time. With add-ons, your helicopter time will be a little light. Unless you trained at their school, most schools, will not hire someone unless they meet the open pilot portion of their insurance. For helicopters that normally means 300 to 500 hours of helicopter time.

[tattooed]

Traitor.

[helo08]

I'm doing something similar right now. I fly with Civil Air Patrol for pennies on the dollar. Just using it to help build some PIC and cross-country time for my instrument. So I understand 100% what you are doing.

[Jeff]

Now don't freak out, I'm still working on the Commercial Helicopter thingy. One of the more seasoned instructors was suggesting that I get an airplane rating. The brainworking here is that I can get the insrtument part done quite a bit cheaper and it also counts for PIC time in "powered aircraft".

 

Part of that option is that I may be able to fly via the community college where my spousal unit works. Therefore, tuition is free. Flight time and fees still apply.

 

So, I'm looking into maybe doing that and also fulfilling the helicopter requirements for the commercial rating. I'll still need at least 35 hours and a bit of night flying for that, but if flying the plane costs two thirds less, then I'm going to seriously look into it.

 

So then, have any of ya'll done, or know someone who has done, something like this?

 

Later

 

Witch,

 

Instead of "squandering" the 35 hours or so you need for your Commercial, go get a CFII and work toward your instrument rating. That will also count toward your commercial. Every hour that you fly should be with an instructor in a helicopter in order to maximize your training dollar. In the long run, it will cost you more if you try to work with airplanes.

 

Jeff

[helonorth]

Keep in mind that helicopter employers are really only interested in helicopter time. With add-ons, your helicopter time will be a little light. Unless you trained at their school, most schools, will not hire someone unless they meet the open pilot portion of their insurance. For helicopters that normally means 300 to 500 hours of helicopter time.

 

I disagree. Airplane time will be considered by employers. It all boils down to insurance. I know

a lot of pilots that have been hired with less than the minimum helicopter time with airplane

experience (I am one of them). Talk to your flight school about it (NOT the CFI's, the person

that PAYS the bills).

[RotorWeed]

I'm finishing up my fixed wing IFR rating right now. One advantage I see to doing the fixed wing IFR rating, and being a helicopter pilot is experience! How often are you going to get to fly a training helicopter in actual IMC conditions? How many helicopter CFII's do you know that have no actual IMC flight time? I know quite a few.

My 2 cents

 

Rotorweed

[rick1128]

I disagree. Airplane time will be considered by employers. It all boils down to insurance. I know

a lot of pilots that have been hired with less than the minimum helicopter time with airplane

experience (I am one of them). Talk to your flight school about it (NOT the CFI's, the person

that PAYS the bills).

 

To the contrary. I am a case in point. All my helicopter ratings are add-ons. Commercial, Instrument, CFI and CFII. Plus these ratings were done at schools with good reputations. Add in a little turbine helicopter time. But my helicopter time is only 175 hours. And I am a high time FW pilot with ATP/MEL, CFI's and check airman experience. Every school I have talked with wants me to have 300 hours or more of helicopter time. And that is to meet the open pilot clause of their insurance. They will hire "THEIR" graduates with less time, because they are a know quality and are technically already on their insurance. While the insurance companies will accept FW time for insurance reasons, they discount it heavily. Mostly due to accident rates of dual rated low helicopter time pilots.

 

To maximize the use of your flight time and to lower coasts, get your private, commercial, then immediate do your CFI, then combine your Instrument and CFII together.

[Witch]

What I'm gettin' at is that one needs 10 hours instrument for commercial. Those hours can be done in the airplane and count for total time.

 

The helis don't have instruments, well 85T does, but no ADF, DME, etc... The airplanes here have those. Therefore, although it's in a different aircraft, it is acceptable. Plus, with a few more hours and a checkride, I'll have another rating on that plastic card. It may not sound like a good idea to have that, but the way I figure it, it'll cost a little less for the commercial rating.

 

I'm thinking of waiting until after CFI to get the instrument rating at this point. The airplane bit is only to get the instrument hours required for the commercial rating.

 

Alles its klar?

 

Later

[Guest pokey]

Nothing wrong w/ airplanes, matter of fact? I kinda like flying them too.

[helonorth]

To the contrary. I am a case in point. All my helicopter ratings are add-ons. Commercial, Instrument, CFI and CFII. Plus these ratings were done at schools with good reputations. Add in a little turbine helicopter time. But my helicopter time is only 175 hours. And I am a high time FW pilot with ATP/MEL, CFI's and check airman experience. Every school I have talked with wants me to have 300 hours or more of helicopter time. And that is to meet the open pilot clause of their insurance. They will hire "THEIR" graduates with less time, because they are a know quality and are technically already on their insurance. While the insurance companies will accept FW time for insurance reasons, they discount it heavily. Mostly due to accident rates of dual rated low helicopter time pilots.

 

To maximize the use of your flight time and to lower coasts, get your private, commercial, then immediate do your CFI, then combine your Instrument and CFII together.

I guess the key word is "want" not "require", as far as flight time. You stated that employers

"are really only interested in helicopter time". Not necessarily true. If you can't get a job with

(I'm assuming) 100's of hours of fixed wing time and previous CFI experience, you're talking

to the wrong people.

Edited May 13, 2008 by helonorth

[Darkhorse]

I'm working on my fixed wing rating right now to cut down $ on my rotor wing rating and instrument ticket. It's my personal opinion but I think being dual rated can only help you, can't see how it would ever "hurt" you.

[heligirl03]

Ok, I did some math, this was driving me crazy with non-specifics.

 

Pre-calculation caveats:

~Flight time costs vary so I guessed at an average...$250/hr dual wet R22, $260/hr dual wet R22 Instrument.

~I didn't use exact FAA minimums bc we all know that's not the norm.

~I used costs for dual, assuming solo time/discount to be the same for everyone to reach training minimums. Obviously if you

weekend joy ride, it's gonna cost ya!

~THIS IS MEANT TO BE GENERIC PART 61, we know how individually unique flight training is for an infinite number of reasons...so

go ahead and add your 02cents b/c it might help the next person in line with a similar situation to yours.

 

PLAN A

65hrs * 250/hr = 16,250 PPL

100hrs * 250/hr = 25,000 CPL

40hrs * 260/hr = 10,400 (Instr)

10hrs * 250/hr = 2,500 CFI

10hrs * 260/hr = 2,600 CFII

215hrs 56,750

 

 

PLAN B

65hrs * 250/hr = 16,500 PPL

40hrs * 260/hr = 10,400 (Instr)

60hrs * 250/hr = 15,000 (CPL)

10hrs * 250/hr = 2,500 CFI

10hrs * 250/hr = 2,600 CFII

175hrs 47,000

+25hrs * 230/hr = 5,750 SOLO, if you have no other options but to buy the hours

200hrs 52,750

 

Post-calculation things to consider:

~Add 50hrs ground if you want to, 50hrs * 45/hr = 2,250.

~You need 100hrs PIC for your CPL. You probably came out of PPL with 11.5hrs PIC (including your checkride).

~Depending on your opportunities, you may or may not wind up paying at the end for the extra hours to reach 200hrs for PLAN B,

or 300hrs for either PLAN A or PLAN B...some schools may have better extra curricular opportunities than others...

PART 141: The choice is still there for what order you want to pursue things. I wouldn't bother worrying about the 5hrs fewer for each rating (total of 15hrs * 250/hr = 3,750 "saved")...those are probably insignificant in the big picture as nearly no one heads into a checkride with the bare minimums...right folks?? However, you can't ignore the required ground so add 150hrs * 45/hr = 6,750.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

I guess in my mind the bottom lines are that 141 is worth it if the Feds are backing you up 60% (GI Bill), and doing Instrument within Commercial can save you bucks if you have other ways to fill in to 200hrs at the end. The $1000 you save by doing 10hrs of Instrument fixed-wing is probably only worth it for the real IMC experience (ooh, *shivers*!) so make sure you do it from 27-37hrs of instrument when you can fully appreciate it, not at 0-10hrs of instrument when you really haven't a clue what you are doing anyway.

 

My R22 Instrument trainer had an HSI, ADF, DME, turn coordinator, attitude indicator, and marker beacon lights/audio...

 

Incidentally, I want a CPL ASEL add-on and Sea endorsement a few years down the road so I can fly seaplanes too but that is not going to get me a heli career out of the gate so I'll wait a bit...just pointing out that I am not anti stuck-wing!

 

Wow, I said a lot. I'm sure it's clear as mud...

That's my math exercise for the week... go ahead, say what you will , just tryin' to help out!

 

HG03

[Sparker]

fixed wingers.......

[ADRidge]

I just priced it.... 155/hr for FW IFR training, 290 RW IFR training at my school. I think I know what I'm going to do next....

[Witch]

Savings can be addicting, huh.

 

I finally found the instructor that left Corvallis. I talked with him and in a couple weeks, I'll start getting the instrument thingy going. I once listened in to one of his lessons about instruments, and to tell you thr truth, it was a lot more conprehensible than the instruction I received back at Travis.

 

Anyhow, I'm looking forward to it, and flying in a plane too.

 

Later