helifool Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 (edited) When and what determines if you can request a departure from "present position" or direct from the ramp. And if you are requesting a departure direct from parking would you contact ground first or just the tower? Also Im a bit confused, if there is a clearance delivery do we need to use it if you are departing VFR? Edited July 12, 2008 by helifool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apiaguy Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 you could probabally write a book of responses to your questions as there are many variables. I will try to consoladate some of the answers based on generalities. assuming you are at a tower controlled airport for these responses.. otherwise you would always depart from your present position unless you needed to move away from other aircraft. a controller is going to have you depart from the easiest location possible that allows some safety based on his knowledge and interpretation.... so if he says "present position" or "direct from the ramp"... what is the difference? Neither location is a specific taxiway or runway. They're just trying to avoid risky maneuvering or overflight of other obstacles and don't really understand alot of the capabilities that rotorcraft have. If you're at a Class D airport I would just contact tower and tell them you're ready to depart giving them you're present position.... I have asked our controllers and they are fine with that... less talking and hassles for them... you can even pick up into a hover before calling if you like... just don't move position alot without telling them what you're doing. If you're at a Class C or B that uses clearance delivery... I have always used it and gone thru the seperate frequencies.. ie ground to tower etc... as that is how I learned fixed wing and the controllers are used to that. Only time I've seen anything different is operators that do alot of training at those locations that have priority codes to expedite delivery. Hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelFire_91 Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 API pretty much hit it... Class D, I usually just call tower, tell them who, where, and what I want. You: "XYZ tower, Copter 123AB, at (insert location here), with information Delta, ready for takeoff, departing to the north." if it's a non-movement area (ramp, parking, etc...) the tower should come back with something like. Tower: "Copter 123AB, XYZ tower, present position, proceed as requested." ("'at your own risk'" might be in there if they can't see you, or don't have a line of sight to you). In a Class C or B, with an operating clearance frequency, then you have to contact them first. You: "XYZ Clearance, Copter 123AB, at (insert location here), with information delta, departing to the west."Clearance: "Copter 123AB, XYZ clearance, fly at or below 8,000, departure frequency 118.1, squak 4673." Then I usually contact tower if I want to depart straight from where I'm at, if I want to depart from somewhere else on the field like a movement area, then I call ground and request an air taxi or hover taxi to the location, then to tower for takeoff. Hope that helps, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helifool Posted July 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 API pretty much hit it... Class D, I usually just call tower, tell them who, where, and what I want. You: "XYZ tower, Copter 123AB, at (insert location here), with information Delta, ready for takeoff, departing to the north." if it's a non-movement area (ramp, parking, etc...) the tower should come back with something like. Tower: "Copter 123AB, XYZ tower, present position, proceed as requested." ("'at your own risk'" might be in there if they can't see you, or don't have a line of sight to you). In a Class C or B, with an operating clearance frequency, then you have to contact them first. You: "XYZ Clearance, Copter 123AB, at (insert location here), with information delta, departing to the west."Clearance: "Copter 123AB, XYZ clearance, fly at or below 8,000, departure frequency 118.1, squak 4673." Then I usually contact tower if I want to depart straight from where I'm at, if I want to depart from somewhere else on the field like a movement area, then I call ground and request an air taxi or hover taxi to the location, then to tower for takeoff. Hope that helps, Thanks for the replies, if you request a north departure from your present position, do you still take off in the direction of the active and then turn to your requested route? I guess it would depend on wind and specific location. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zenmaster Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 Helifool, I am a controller up in the northwest at an airport with quite a few helicopter operations and angelfire hit it exactly. If you depart and the winds happen to be perpindicular to an active runway, depart into the wind but DO NOT CROSS THE RUNWAY until approved to do so. Trust me controllers typically do not know what winds do to helicopters so they assume you will not cross an active runway. Also when you depart from a non-movement area you are responsible for your own safety such as missing other aircraft, vehicles, people, dogs, and whatever else might be lurking in a non-movement area. Controllers are not responsible for those areas therefore they do not neccessarly know the dangers lurking in those areas - the PIC is responsible for that. Hope that helps. zenmaster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gomer Pylot Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 It depends on the airport. Some places, like HOU, like for you to just call the tower direct, not clearance delivery, ground, or anyone else. Other places want you to do it all by the book - clearance, ground, then tower. In general, the more helicopter ops there are at an airport, the more relaxed and knowledgeable the controllers are. Local knowledge helps a lot with this. You can always request a departure from your present position, but you won't always get it. I once departed HOU from one of the pads when the airliners were backed up all down the taxiways, dozens of them in line for delayed departures. Tower cleared us for one of the standard helicopter departures, and one of the airline captains complained about us jumping in line. Tower told him that if he could depart from present position, and use and cross no runways, he was free to depart immediately. I think our CVR recorded some giggling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C of G Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 It depends on the airport. Some places, like HOU, like for you to just call the tower direct, not clearance delivery, ground, or anyone else. Other places want you to do it all by the book - clearance, ground, then tower. In general, the more helicopter ops there are at an airport, the more relaxed and knowledgeable the controllers are. Local knowledge helps a lot with this. You can always request a departure from your present position, but you won't always get it. I once departed HOU from one of the pads when the airliners were backed up all down the taxiways, dozens of them in line for delayed departures. Tower cleared us for one of the standard helicopter departures, and one of the airline captains complained about us jumping in line. Tower told him that if he could depart from present position, and use and cross no runways, he was free to depart immediately. I think our CVR recorded some giggling. It helps that one of the controllers at Hobby was an offshore helicopter pilot. Sounds like a perfect response from the tower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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