questions

[wannabe87]

Hello, I am new to this forum, and had a few questions, this seems like the site to ask them on. I am relatively new to the helicopter world. I am coming from a fixed-wing background, as I am a check ride away from holding my private pilot fixed-wing. I am currently overseas working in Army Aviation, and I have grown up in aviation. My dad was an Army helicopter pilot, as well as a professional airplane pilot, and now works for the FAA. I have worked in aviation ever since I was 18, and before that I volunteered in the Civil Air Patrol as well as just around the airport as a typical "airport rat". I have many great memories of my dad picking me up in the backyard of our house in a helicopter. I remember my first helicopter flight like it was yesterday, and it remains one of my best memories. I have had the chance to do some very cool things in helicopters just being in the Army as well. However, I do not have the opportunity to fly for the Army, I did not pass the colorblindness test for the Army flight physical. I do currently hold an FAA 1st class medical, as that was the first thing I did after failing the Army flight physical, I passed the colorblind test for the FAA. Until about 6 months ago I was just going to try and become an airline pilot, I figured helicopters were just out of the question. Now the more I think about it, the more I realize that I would hate being a "systems manager" at 30,000 feet for the rest of my life. I cannot push the want/desire/passion/need to fly helicopters out of my mind, no matter how hard I try. It truly is an addiction!!!! SO, now for my questions...

 

1. Is a civilian trained helicopter pilot looked down on by the companies one would want to fly for, and also by the Army Aviators?

 

2. I am looking at Bristow Academy to do my training with, as they are close to my family, and seem like a great school. Because I am overseas I am unable to go visit them and have just been emailing the school and talking with them. I have secured a June 2010 spot, it is not definite that I will train with them, but it seemed like the filled classes rather quickly, so I wanted to have them as an option for when I return home. Can ANYONE tell me about them? I know that the school is going to "praise" themselves, so I want honest opinions from anyone that has any knowledge of the school. Anything on this topic would be great!!!

 

3. I have been saving every penny since I have been deployed for flight training, so I should have about $30,000 to put towards school. Is that a good number? I know that the school will cost double that, but I also plan on using my VA benefits to help with some of the cost as well.

 

4. I believe that I qualify for the MGIB REAP benefit, does anyone know if this is better than the standard Montgomery GI Bill for reserves? Also, can anyone explain the differences and how these programs work?

 

5. How important is a degree in this career? I do not have a degree yet, I had planned on getting my degree online after I secured a decent job flying. Is this possible, or a good idea, or would you suggest just going to UND, or another college full-time?

 

6. ANY advise on what else I may be able to do for loans etc...? I know that I would have to get a loan for the rest of my training after the $30,000 I will have because Bristow requires proof of funds, they do not require a contract or full payment up front, but they do require proof of funds, so I would have to get a loan and wait for the GI bill to start paying, then use the GI bill to pay for most of the loan. Any info or advice ANYONE can give me on this would be very helpful!!

 

7. Also, any other tips, advice, guidance, etc. would also be soooo helpful. Anything you can share with me would help so much. I am new to this career path, and need all the information I can get!

 

8. One more thing... Can you tell me about your current helicopter jobs, and how you enjoy it? Just some views as to what I can expect. I am very excited about this career field, and would just love some motivation for while I am overseas.

 

I am sorry for this long post, but I just have so many question and cannot seem to get them answered.

 

THANKS FOR ANY HELP YOU CAN GIVE ME!!!!!

[Helibear]

Welcome

 

1. Is a civilian trained helicopter pilot looked down on by the companies one would want to fly for, and also by the Army Aviators?

 

It doesn't matter. Company's are looking for personality and attitude.

 

2. I am looking at Bristow Academy ...

 

Sure a good school, I don't have any personal experience with them.

But do not let somebody tell you do sign up for a class a year in advance, without having seen the school and talking to some people personally.

There are a lot of good schools out there which are desperate for students.

 

3. I have been saving every penny ...

30.000 plus VA Benefits sounds not bad for me. Of course it depends on the details of the VA program you are eligible for. I don't know details about VA.

 

 

5. How important is a degree in this career?

Well, it is not required for most jobs. It sure looks good on a resumee though.

i know that a lot of VA students go through Aviation College programs. It would consider that. As far as I know the VA is paying for College Tuitions as well.

 

6. ANY advise on what else I may be able to do for loans ...

Look into VA first. A good school will work out a plan with you, to determine how VA+Savings can work. Taking out a loan just to proof funding doesn't make sence to me.

 

8. One more thing... Can you tell me about your current helicopter jobs ...

 

I'm working as a CFII, and I like it.

 

Take Care

 

Helibear

[glennahall]

Hey there W87,

 

Here's my two cents based on observation and personal beliefs about different crap...

 

1. Is a civilian trained helicopter pilot looked down on by the companies one would want to fly for, and also by the Army Aviators?

 

I'm a former Army Aviator and it doesn't matter. I've got a certificate and a little time. Other Army guys usually want to trade war stories and some young civvies MIGHT want to hear your history soup. Civilian trained pilots may like watching your gun camera footage (of which I have none) but DO NOT want to listen to any military guy talk about how great they are. Humility is a helicopter pilot's best dang friend whether in the air or on the ground. Good time, Good certs/training/experience, good attitude... that's what matters.

 

2. I am looking at Bristow Academy...

 

It seems to me that they are really making you jump through hoops. That'd be a turn off for me. A student pilot (of which I am one for fixed wing right now) is a CONSUMER. There are too may GOOD trainers/schools out there to let one run you around if it isn't called for. Bristow is a big name but sheesh.

 

3. I have been saving every penny since I have been deployed for flight training, so I should have about $30,000 to put towards school. Is that a good number? I know that the school will cost double that, but I also plan on using my VA benefits to help with some of the cost as well.

 

It's great. I would use ALL VA benefits first and go to cash as a last resort. Unless you are literally going to be training full time, you'll probably want to get an easy job while in school. I'd suggest something easy and flexible even if it doesn't pay much. Like being a security guy. You'd make enough to pay cheap room and board and could study between blotter entries. You already know how to live simply and lean. Your doing it right now. Keep doing that while in school.

 

4. I believe that I qualify for the MGIB REAP benefit, does anyone know if this is better than the standard Montgomery GI Bill for reserves? Also, can anyone explain the differences and how these programs work?

 

Clueless, sorry.

 

5. How important is a degree in this career? I do not have a degree yet, I had planned on getting my degree online after I secured a decent job flying. Is this possible, or a good idea, or would you suggest just going to UND, or another college full-time?

 

Don't personally know about the degree. From what I've seen, no one asks for one. Can't hurt though unless it keeps you from accomplishing your real goal. If it helps you accomplish your goal - like you can get better benefits for going to college or something - then go for it. If you are good self studier, online is a great idea later on. If your not, online may not be such a great idea. In fact, as I think about it, if your not good at studying on your own, you may not want to become a pilot!

 

6. ANY advise on what else I may be able to do for loans etc...? I know that I would have to get a loan for the rest of my training after the $30,000 I will have because Bristow requires proof of funds, they do not require a contract or full payment up front, but they do require proof of funds, so I would have to get a loan and wait for the GI bill to start paying, then use the GI bill to pay for most of the loan. Any info or advice ANYONE can give me on this would be very helpful!!

 

Here's my advise on getting a loan. Don't do it. Use your GI Bill benefits, cash and paycheck to pay your way. You'll be happy down the road when you aren't paying out nose in loan payments. If your benefits aren't enough for Bristow... well, that would be IT for me. I'd drop 'em like a... something disgusting. Screw them if you can't pay as you go. I'll probably tick off some Bristow folks and I'm sorry for that, but that kind of policy is just unconscionable to me.

 

Now... Having said that. IF you want to get a loan TO BUILD CREDIT, that's different. Just pay the loan off with your GI BILL as quickly as possible. Live lean, my friend. You'll be glad you did.

 

I'd still seriously consider a different school if Bristow's policies are that jacked up.

 

It's an employers market when it comes to jobs but it's a student's market when it comes to schools. Or at least it should be.

 

7. Also, any other tips, advice, guidance, etc. would also be soooo helpful. Anything you can share with me would help so much. I am new to this career path, and need all the information I can get!

 

While you are in the military, make use of every opportunity you can that is aviation related. You said you're in Army Aviation but you didn't specify what area you work in. ATC, Mechanic, Personnel Admin. in a CH-47 Battalion? What ever it is, get experiences. Go to Air Assault School, get your A&P, join the MWR Flying Club, go find a CFI/CFII, buy the guy running the simulators a case of beer and go fly the things. Don't expect to ever get to impress anyone with what you've done. Plan to impress them with what you can do... because of what you've done that you don't tell them about.

 

8. One more thing... Can you tell me about your current helicopter jobs, and how you enjoy it? Just some views as to what I can expect. I am very excited about this career field, and would just love some motivation for while I am overseas.

 

I'm working on creating my own helicopter job. I'm doing some foundation laying work and getting fixed wing certs (of all things!) that may lead to some pretty dang cool opportunities that are of my own making. A little non-traditional. That's ok, though. I'm not getting paid as a pilot right now. I'm working at something completely non-aviation to pay the bills and pave the way for great aviation stuff to come. The story is long and boring but should have a freaking cool ending.

 

Stay focused.

 

Very best regards,

G

[Wally]

1. Is a civilian trained helicopter pilot looked down on by the companies one would want to fly for, and also by the Army Aviators?

 

There was a time when most of my colleagues were ex-Army, Vietnam-era military trained, long since passed. Some of the best pilots- in fact, the BEST stick I ever worked with are 100% civilian trained.

 

...

 

5. How important is a degree in this career? I do not have a degree yet, I had planned on getting my degree online after I secured a decent job flying. Is this possible, or a good idea, or would you suggest just going to UND, or another college full-time?

 

Education is a plus on any resume. You don't need it- yet- to do the job. I don' got some deegree, bEn wurking 40 yeers. All kidding aside, get a degree, at least, but do it for yourself.

 

...

 

7. Also, any other tips, advice, guidance, etc. would also be soooo helpful. Anything you can share with me would help so much. I am new to this career path, and need all the information I can get!

 

Never give up. Have a plan, not just a dream, and know you're gonna have to work hard and long.

 

8. One more thing... Can you tell me about your current helicopter jobs, and how you enjoy it? Just some views as to what I can expect. I am very excited about this career field, and would just love some motivation for while I am overseas.

 

Presently, and for the past 8+ years, I'm doing an EMS pilot gig. It has unhappy moments, but mostly it's an opportunity to work with some really great people.

[tattooed]

Just a quick 2 cents from me...not going for the Guiness Book of World Records in forum postings (ha ha ha glennahall...I think you win the prize!!).

 

I'm not a big fan of the large schools, and helibear is correct, lots of small schools are desperate for students. I'd look around more in your families area for something that fits you well. In my experience (having attended both large and small school), you get far more personal time with a small school, more flexibility with training (especially if you are NOT 141), and more opportunity to work with real world pilots (at the small school, the Chief CFI has been in the business for..well...he'd kill me if I posted how long...but he's done all types of flying, and regularly introduces me to people in the business...potential employers...you don't get that with large school that are more or less "pilot puppy mills").

 

Don't get me wrong, the training at the large school is excellent, the syllabi are very good (I wrote my 61 lesson plans off the 141 lessons from the large school I attended).

I just got shoved aside alot, especially when there were alot of ships in mtx (seems all the 100 hours were up at the same freakin' time!!) for stage checks and checkrides.

 

Also, large schools are more expensive (my training cost was cut nearly in half when I moved to the small school).

 

As far as work....not much out there right now. Especially for us low-timers. Too many CFI's looking for work. You need to do your best to make yourself competitive, and you have to be strong. It's a tough business. I have seen dozen of students quit and go back home after spending $25,000. It's not for everyone. It's mentally and physically quite challenging.

 

And emotionally challenging. Recently lost a friend in a heli ax, and even though I wasn't super close to him, my good friends are and seeing everyone so sad and upset is so difficult.

Dangerous business. We all need to be prepared.

 

 

Just food for though.

 

 

T

[wannabe87]

Hello and thanks for the replies! What about a school in Alaska? I have always wanted to fly in Alaska, and it seems that the flight time up there would be a good thing for future jobs. There is a small flight school close to where I live in TN, it is called Noble Aviation. Does anyone have any info on that school?

[glennahall]

Just a quick 2 cents from me...not going for the Guiness Book of World Records in forum postings (ha ha ha glennahall...I think you win the prize!!).

 

Hey! I resemble that remark!

 

Bet you never heard that one before.

[BlackHwk27]

Right now, there are flight schools that are getting on board with the updated GI Bill. The school I went to and worked at, for example. You can get flight training 100% paid for, even money for room and board, all if you take at least 1 college course from a community college. Pretty sick! To think now you can be done with flight school with zero bills, that's damn significant, I certainly wish it was around a few years ago when I came up through.

 

The school is Northeast Helicopters (http://www.northeasthelicopters.com). I'm sure there are other schools working on it as well, if you don't like New England.

Edited September 27, 2009 by BlackHwk27

[mechanic]

This guy is in TN.

 

Michael

[wannabe87]

Yea, I do live in TN. There is a school close to where I am in TN(Nashville) in Lebanon, TN. It is called Noble Aviation. They seem to have good prices($195/hr block rate), but are not VA approved, they dont have mountain courses, they just fly the R-22 and R44's. What should I do, I am very willing to move(I kinda want to get out of TN for a while, and love to travel), but if I were move it would have to be for a much better school. I am looking at Alyeska helicopters in Alaska, would the mountain flying up there help me a lot in finding a job? I am also looking at Leading Edge Aviation and Hillboro Aviation in Oregon. Can anyone help me out with this? Im not what the best idea is, I do want to be able to get an instructor job soon after finishing school. Also, if anyone knows of any other really good schools let me know... Thanks

[rick1128]

First of all try to make as much good use of your time while you are overseas as possible. There are several handbooks available on the FAA website, including the 'helicopter pilots handbook'. It appears you have or have access to a computer, so if possible have your family send you the ASA private pilot test guide CD so you can start working on your written.

 

Since you are in Army Aviation, you have access to a tremendous amount of information. I don't know of any units that don't have at least one instructor pilot. They should be able to help you with technical questions.

 

Personally I would look long and hard at large schools, especially those that have a large percentage of foreign students. My primary concern with these schools would be their scheduling practices. If aircraft are unavailable due to maintenance, etc, are these students given priority? I have seen a couple of schools where this is the case. The larger schools also tend to be more expensive not only in the direct costs of the school but also in living expenses.

 

Since most schools like to see at least 25 to 50 hours in make and model, to give yourself the maximum amount of possibilities job wise, I would do my private in the R22, commercial in the H300, Instrument in the H300 and R44 (at least 25 hours), My CFI in the R22 and the CFII in the Enstrom. This will most likely require you to change schools a little bit. And this is just a suggestion.