Sim Time for Add-On?

[air_1]

I've got my commercial stuck wing ticket but I'm wanting to get my private add-on for helicopters. Barring flight proficiency, how much sim time can you do in a sim to to get the add-on private rating? I've looked through the FARS but I must be missing something. Thanks in advance!

[Trans Lift]

None that I know of!!

[SBuzzkill]

Ehh, I don't know. I do know that flying a sim is nothing like a real helicopter.

Edited August 6, 2010 by SBuzzkill

[Rick McWilliams]

Helicopters need pilot control all of the time. I used to fly my Zlin to helicopter lessons. I would finish the helicopter lesson sweaty and tense. The return flight in the airplane was so easy, apply power, rotate, flap up, trim, propeller, mixture, turn toward home. I had something to do for a full 45 seconds, then sit.

 

My wifes red R22 flys all of the time. The Zlin does not see nearly as much action. Watch out Helicopters are addictive.

[Goldy]

I've got my commercial stuck wing ticket but I'm wanting to get my private add-on for helicopters. Barring flight proficiency, how much sim time can you do in a sim to to get the add-on private rating? I've looked through the FARS but I must be missing something. Thanks in advance!

 

It's pretty clear you can use 2.5 sim hours towards your private, but as an add on the language is so incomprehensible, only the FAA could have written it!

 

Can't help you there...

 

Goldy

[RtrCFI]

I recently worked at a school that had a Frasca FTD. The school had a letter from the FAA authorizing the use of the FTD for up to 7.0 hours of aeronautical experience. We used it for start-up/shutdown, intro to traffic pattern, intro to approaches and autos, and inadvertent IMC.

 

While definitely a money saver, and handy on those bad weather days, my opinion as an instructor was that it was not a productive tool. In the end, it just wasn't close enough to flying the aircraft. Usually my students had to repeat the lesson in the aircraft anyway. Although, I may just be a crappy teacher.

 

One final note about using the FTD, make sure that your local FSDO has signed off on it. I discovered that some FAA guys were not keen on the idea, despite the letter. (Ahh, the FAA.)

[Trans Lift]

The only thing i would ever use it for would be start up or shutdown procedures. It is pointless to use it for any other flight training than IFR in my opinion.

Edited August 7, 2010 by Trans Lift

[rick1128]

I have found the FTDs are good for things like normal procedures of starting, shutting down, emergency procedures and instrument procedures. Basically things that take a great deal of time to instruct, but where you don't want to spend a lot of valuable helicopter time to train. Instrument procedures are where they really shine. With a tracking system, you can show the student right where their were and they can see it for themselves. As for emergency procedures, you can let them go to a complete crash and then smack them along side the head and say "I told you not to do that!". It makes the point much clearer and it helps them to develop a pattern. But much of this is dependent on the quality of the FTD.

[air_1]

I recently worked at a school that had a Frasca FTD. The school had a letter from the FAA authorizing the use of the FTD for up to 7.0 hours of aeronautical experience. We used it for start-up/shutdown, intro to traffic pattern, intro to approaches and autos, and inadvertent IMC.

 

I also heard 7 hours somewhere or another. I was just curios because I thought it would be well suited for startup/shutdown procedures and the like besides actually flying the aircraft as you others have noted. Thanks for all the input!

[Mikemv]

FTDs are very useful for Scenario Based Training,(SBT), either VFR or IFR. Schools with FTDs need to indoctrinate and train CFIs on how to use them and have SBT lessons prepared. They really are a great way to teach ADM & Situational Awareness. Of course they are good for all the items listed above as Procedures, etc.

 

Granted they do not "fly" exactly like the actual helo but think of them as a new or different model with a different feel! Career pilots and CFIs should be proficient in them if available.

 

As FITS and other entities revise flight training methods in the future, FTDs will come into basic training more and more.

 

Best to All

 

Mike

[Peter PanPan]

Wouldn't that fall under Part 142? I believe ERAU did a complete ab-initio Fixed Wing PPL course utilizing exclusively a Sim, you could ask FlightSafety about that but it doesn't sound cost-effective at all flying on Sim in order to get an add-on at Private Level. 30 hours of real helo time, wether it's 22 or 300 will always be cheaper than a simulator.