Yet another crash in Kauai / second in three days

[AIR9ENG]

http://www.khnl.com/Global/story.asp?S=6211018

 

HANALEI - (KHNL) There has been another helicopter crash on Kauai. It happened just after 1 p.m. in Hanalei near the YMCA camp.

 

A spokesperson for the Department of Transportation says one person is in critical condition another three are being treated for injuries at the scene. A witness tells News 8 that it appears there may have been one fatality.

 

This is the second helicopter crash on Kauai in three days. On Thursday a Heli-Usa helicopter crashed at the Princeville aiport killing four and critically injuring three others. Stay with KHNL News 8 for the latest.

Edited March 12, 2007 by AIR9ENG

[Tenacious T]

Update:

 

 

March 12, 2007 05:07 AM

Second Chopper Crash On Kauai In 4 Days

 

 

by: Beth Hillyer

 

HANALEI, KAUAI (KHNL) - Eyewitnesses describe the terrifying moments right before a helicopter crashed on Kauai this afternoon at 1:05 p.m. It is the second chopper crash in 4 days, and it happened near the site of the first chopper crash on the north shore of Kauai.

 

The Kauai Fire Department says one person is dead and four others are injured. There were 5 people on board. The Federal Aviation Administration says the 30 year old pilot reported hearing a loud bang and lost control of the aircraft. The helicopter hit some trees with its main rotor blade.

 

According to the FAA Western-Pacific Region Communications Manager Ian Gregor, "(The pilot) has a commercial rotorcraft (helicopter) certificate and an instrument rating, which means he is licensed to fly in bad weather. The pilot was not talking to air traffic control. Air tour operators typically are not in touch with controllers when they are flying in uncontrolled airspace in good weather."

 

Gregor also says the helicopter is owned by Smokey Mountain Helicopters out of Delaware. It's the parent company of Inter-Island Helicopter, which had a fatal accident on December 25, 2005. The pilot died while fighting a fire. Inter-Island Helicopter conducts a lot of search and rescue missions.

 

FAA & National Transportation Safety Board inspectors are on the scene. They had been in the area to investigate last Thursday's Heli USA crash at the Princeville airport which killed four and critically injured three others.

 

NTSB investigator Brian Rayner says, "The witnesses said pieces departed the helicopter. There are pieces into the ocean. When we took inventory the tail rotor, drive shaft, and gear box are not with helicopter."

 

NTSB divers will go into the ocean off Hanalei Monday to search for the pieces that fell off. Those are important pieces of evidence that could help the investigation.

 

Hundreds of people in the Hanalei community both heard a boom and saw the tour chopper spiral out of the sky. Many are in shock given this is the second fatal tour crash in four days. The tour chopper came down in this Hanalei campsite where Winston Welborn is the caretaker. "I was upstairs in living room, heard a loud thud like a mechanical part. Then I came outside to see the nose and I witnessed the helicopter hit ground right where it lays now."

 

Witness Mc McCann says, "We heard the copter first. It went into a controlled spin with a large arch. I became more concerned as got into a tighter and tighter spiral then it just went straight down. It disappeared from view into the tree line and I heard a loud explosion."

 

Yet another witness, Zion Still, adds, "I looked at it because it was twirling in the air, getting all messed up, and it was getting lower and lower. My dad helped pull the people out. We did our best to keep the scene safe and make sure there were no hazards. We did the best we could to extricate people."

 

This YMCA where the helicopter went down is just 9 miles from Princeville where Thursday's accident took place.

 

John Rodden, another eyewitness, remarks, "It's terrible considering what happened to the other helicopter a couple of days ago. It's unbelieveable; too tragic. They have got to take a good hard look at this- 2 (accidents) in one week?

 

Many say this crash could have been even worse. There are normally kids playing in the campground where the helicopter went down. Witnesses credit the pilot with keeping the chopper away from homes.

[RotorWeed]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,258247,00.html

 

This story has a picture.

 

rdw

[DonRow]

The real story about what the pilot had to do. http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/...P703120356.html

 

All what the other news is saying is a bunch of crap.

[Tenacious T]

Good job in a worse case scenario. He saved a few lives.

[klas]

When you lose your tail rotar & you are spinning, how much control do you have?

[Pogue]

When you lose your tail rotar & you are spinning, how much control do you have?

I think it depends on how you lose the tail rotor. If you lose the drive to it (every thing is still there, just no power) you can autorotate and eliminate torque. If the tailrotor leaves the aircraft you may have some serious weght and balance problems - particularly if it takes the gearbox with it. I'm not sure what the real values are for an MD-500, but think about what the loss of 10 pounds at the end of a 15 foot lever is going to do to your center of gravity. You probably don't have enough aft cyclic left to maintain a level attitude, much less flare.

[klas]

I think it depends on how you lose the tail rotor. If you lose the drive to it (every thing is still there, just no power) you can autorotate and eliminate torque. If the tailrotor leaves the aircraft you may have some serious weght and balance problems - particularly if it takes the gearbox with it. I'm not sure what the real values are for an MD-500, but think about what the loss of 10 pounds at the end of a 15 foot lever is going to do to your center of gravity. You probably don't have enough aft cyclic left to maintain a level attitude, much less flare.

 

I know that you can control it if stuff is still there, but the article said, "..with its tail rotor ripped off..". Does that mean totally gone? Isn't that why it spun? It seems to me that you are at the mercy of the gods of luck at that point.... How much control do you really have to avoid putting it down somewhere, or putting it somewhere?

[nbit]

I believe this is the helicopter involved in the accident.

Glad most turned out OK, and the results were not worse. Condolences to all injured and the family of the one lost.

[DonRow]

I think it depends on how you lose the tail rotor. If you lose the drive to it (every thing is still there, just no power) you can autorotate and eliminate torque. If the tailrotor leaves the aircraft you may have some serious weght and balance problems - particularly if it takes the gearbox with it. I'm not sure what the real values are for an MD-500, but think about what the loss of 10 pounds at the end of a 15 foot lever is going to do to your center of gravity. You probably don't have enough aft cyclic left to maintain a level attitude, much less flare.

 

 

Sounds easy huh?? try doing it when your in a spin. thats all Im going to say. trust me it's not easy.... Train hard guys it dose pay off in the end .

Edited March 17, 2007 by DonRow

[Linc]

Hate to sound like an ass but. Sounds easy huh?? try doing it when your in a tight spin. and your mind is going a 100 miles an hour. thats all Im going to say. Guess who this is. trust me it's not easy.... thats all i'll say.

Hmmm...

Helicopter pilot Donald Torres, a 30-year-old new father and local boy from Hanapepe, by all accounts did a heroic job yesterday of guiding an out-of-control helicopter with its tail rotor ripped off to the only open patch of ground in the Ha'ena area.

DonRow

Student Poster

Group: VR Member

Posts: 14

Joined: 10-January 03

From: Kalaheo, Kauai Hawaii

Member No.: 104

Ooh, ooh! Pick me, Mr. Kottah!!

[nbit]

Another article... Interesting blog entry here... Sounds like a favorable outcome all considered. Glad you're OK!

Edited March 14, 2007 by nbit

[Pogue]

Sounds easy huh??

No, it doesn't sound easy, and I hope I didn't make it sound that way in my post. I never really thought about the weight and balance issues with a loss of tail rotor until I read about a case in "Fatal Traps." I spend a lot of time thinking about what options I would have given different types of failures. I would be very interested in learning what worked, what didn't and what kind of things were going on.

 

Damn good job getting it on the ground.

[Rachel]

Wow, I just got news of this horrible event yesterday. My final goal was to find myself flying for an outfit on one of the Hawaiian Islands.

R

[Tenacious T]

When you lose your tail rotar & you are spinning, how much control do you have?

 

Just to clarify a point, it sounds like in this situation what actually happened was "loss of tail" not "loss of tail rotor. Seems like it would be a big difference. Probably pretty hard to auto rotate when your CG just shifted forward a few feet at the same time as you lose anti-torque.

 

Don, some day when you are ready to talk about it I would really like to know what steps you took to get down to that clearing and save the lives of yourself and the survivors. It is a rare opportunity when a fellow pilot survives a worse case scenario and can share the lesson with the rest of us. I'm glad you're ok.

[C of G]

Don,

 

Check your PM's.

[blave]

I am a frequent visitor to the islands, and like many I dream of flying tours there someday although I don't think I'll ever acquire enough time to do it. But at any rate, I follow all of the operators over there fairly closely (at least as closely as the web allows), and I was disappointed to see the Safari Helicopters owner take his opportunity to diss a competitor for flying "doors off".

 

At this point, I am not aware that even a tentative reason for the crash has been determined. Shame on Safari for implying that FOD from the cabin is to blame.

 

I might've gone flying with Safari someday, but not now. Blue or Paradise will get my dollar(S) whenever I decide to take my wife on a ride to see either Kiluea or Waipio Valley.

 

Dave Blevins

[ADRidge]

My hat goes of to you, Don. From what I hear, that was a situation that very few pilots walk away from and it sounds like you did the best job humanly possible.

 

I will be interested to see what the NTSB says on why the bird lost its tail.