CharyouTree Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 I don't mean the training itself; that's (obviously? Unless I'm wrong) more expensive due to the increased fuel consumption. Why is the time itself, or the training in it, or whatever, seen as a big deal? I have nearly 600 hours, every last minute of it in turbine, so I feel like there's a part to the equation that I just don't understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apiaguy Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 I don't think it is a big deal unless you plan on flying turbine powered aircraft... and then it is to satisfy insurance requirements and make you more proficient in a larger airframe.Employers want employees who come to the table with time and experience in the airframe they operate. If not that airframe then a comparable airframe and a piston powered machine is usually not a good comparison for power, weight and mission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharyouTree Posted January 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 Well that makes more sense. I was looking at it from an engine only perspective. I guess I hadn't made the connection until now that "turbine = larger aircraft" (and concurrently, most non-training aircraft?)? So would I, with twin engine turbine be (generally) more valuable to an employer than say a Robbie guy? (With the obvious exceptions of piston, or esp. Robbie jobs) Sidenote:I feel like I'm at a bit of a disadvantage, having all of this good training, and hours, etc, but I still couldn't get a job as a CFI because I have no time in the smaller aircraft. Would I generally have to go out and get trained in say an R22 before I could hope to land a job as a CFI? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pogue Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 Sidenote:I feel like I'm at a bit of a disadvantage, having all of this good training, and hours, etc, but I still couldn't get a job as a CFI because I have no time in the smaller aircraft. Would I generally have to go out and get trained in say an R22 before I could hope to land a job as a CFI?You could CFI at Rucker, but going from a Black Hawk or Apache to civilian is pretty tough. The big thing is there's no money in it compared to the military. If you get your FI (or is it SI?) you can now get that converted to CFI/CFII otherwise you end up paying for training. To instruct in Robbies you need 50 hours in type assuming you have > 200 hours TT. That's just a lot of money to spend on your own. You can legally instruct in something like an S300 or Enstrom with 5 hours PIC, but from a practical standpoint there aren't going to be too many companies looking to hire someone with 5 hours in type when they have a waiting list of students they know. Law enforcement seems to work well with Guard pilots - we have two that fly with the DPS in the civilian world. They keep seniority and all that during deployments. There are always other opportunities, but military pilots apparently are not getting a "buy" on hours requirements in the civilian world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldy Posted January 27, 2011 Report Share Posted January 27, 2011 Sidenote:I feel like I'm at a bit of a disadvantage, having all of this good training, and hours, etc, but I still couldn't get a job as a CFI because I have no time in the smaller aircraft. Would I generally have to go out and get trained in say an R22 before I could hope to land a job as a CFI? Most guys get a CFI so they can build some hours, usually up from about 200TT. With your time and training, I would think you could go straight to the commercial world now and find a job flying a 206. When you get up to 1500 or so, then you could apply into the GOM....(from what I hear, not that I know personally). Like some posts mention, its about familiarity with type and insurance reqs. I think your time and training is marketable, so now its just who do you know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r22butters Posted January 27, 2011 Report Share Posted January 27, 2011 ...So would I, with twin engine turbine be (generally) more valuable to an employer than say a Robbie guy? (With the obvious exceptions of piston, or esp. Robbie jobs)... Sometimes I feel like nobody gives a rats ass what I've done, or what I've done it in, unless I first have that f'n 1000hrs. at the top! So with only 600hrs (even all turbine) you may still be screwed, and have to get those 50hrs in an R22 and teach? However, since you do have so much turbine, you might try Temsco, or Papillion. They usually start hiring about now, and who knows, you may get lucky? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharyouTree Posted January 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Pogue: that's actually my plan right now, to go ADOS for 2-3 years down at Rucker teaching the Hawk course as a W-2. Can't beat that with a stick, as far as I'm concerned. Just waiting on my commander to get me a recommendation for my packet. That other stuff about CFI in the civilian world is pretty much what I assumed. Why take someone who barely meets the minimums for that aircraft, when you can have someone who's been flying it for a year? Butters: minimum of 1000 PiC for tours with Temsco, 1500 for field work (per the website). I actually WANT to teach, I just don't particularly care to do so in the R22, but it seems that that's where the action is as far as training goes. I also don't want to spend a crazy amount of money to learn to do something I know how to do. This thread seems to have taken an unintended turn. It had occurred to me that I didn't understand why people get wrapped around the axle with turbine time, so I asked about it. It just kind of took that turn as it became small aircraft vs large aircraft, and my experience vs a typical civilian only pilot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heligirl03 Posted January 31, 2011 Report Share Posted January 31, 2011 A few more points to throw into the mix On this one I agree with Apiaguy, "turbine time" is generally more about airframe and application. There is also some element of turbine time being considered valuable because it means you've successfully and repeatedly started and operated a $100k+ engine without melting it...a different task than with the pistons most of us civvies have the majority of our time in. Also, the 1000hrs is not necessarily just an arbitrary number that all operators can ignore by choice. For instance, of the 1000hr jobs available, many if not most of them are offered by tour operators. Most of the tour operators often mentioned here are members of TOPS (Tour Operator Program of Safety), and 1000hrs PIC is one of the minimum requirements for hiring under this group (like CAMTS for EMS except TOPS is a non-profit - which makes a big difference if you get deeper into it than this thread warrants). So regardless if ALL of your time is in turbines, you may truly just not meet the minimums for the operators' continued membership. GoM operators are different, I know several people with the right experience, work ethic, and network who got in with those guys at 700 or 800 PIC, both MIL and CIV. One sidenote, TEMSCO says 1500 for field work but in reality what they mean is, 1500 in type, longline and AK time, and/or 2-3 seasons flying tours with them previously. Fun stuff and amazing places to see though!! Blue Skies, HG03 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r22butters Posted January 31, 2011 Report Share Posted January 31, 2011 ...Most of the tour operators often mentioned here are members of TOPS (Tour Operator Program of Safety), and 1000hrs PIC is one of the minimum requirements for hiring under this group... Ah, my Nemesis has a name! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pohi Posted January 31, 2011 Report Share Posted January 31, 2011 Lol butters, you have a way with words Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gomer Pylot Posted January 31, 2011 Report Share Posted January 31, 2011 One other reason that turbine time is valuable is that turbines are valuable. Replacing a turbine engine in a helicopter will cost the company about a quarter of a million dollars. It takes about 2 seconds to melt one if you don't know what you're doing, or don't pay very close attention during the start. If you've flown a few hundred hours without having a hotstart, you're way ahead of someone who's never started one, at least in the eyes of the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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