Premier Helicopter Crash

[BOATFIXERGUY]

Boatfixer, I have read many of your posts and school reviews and find some of them to be less than flattering, yet you find it easy to criticize ercam and his opinion of Premier. Double standard? Read his review of Rotors of the Rockies... really, they’re not interested in teaching people how to work helicopters? C'mon. I could go on but enough said.

 

First of all, read my posts again. I never criticized ercam1991. My posts are not constantly edited like someone else's. I did offer some suggestions in how to post. Never once is there negative criticism or name calling as he has done to several others.

 

Second, as others have said, the forum is not the place for posting reviews on schools or blatant name calling. There is a separate place just for that. And I stand by my post in the review. It is open for EVERYONE TO READ. You just stared there, and you have no idea what you're talking about. I will not get into any other name slinging in this thread. You and I have talked, and you know why I am dissatisfied with them. I'm sure they have their reasons for what they did, don't care anymore.

[BOATFIXERGUY]

If you search Colorado Secretary of State Business site, ercam's assertion that he has changed names numerous times is true. Check it out at: http://www.sos.state.co.us/biz/BusinessEntityCriteriaExt.do type in Premier helicopters and see what you get.

 

Who cares if they changed their name? It doesn't protect them from liability. Name changes are common in business. As they grow or add services, a name change is sometimes required. Do you honestly think if they change their name it's to limit lawsuits? They are still Premier Helicopters in one form or another aren't they?

[Goldy]

Goldy, You have no idea what your talking about...If you lease R-22's...you should know this!...click here http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance...33;OpenDocument

 

Applicability: Model R22 series helicopters, all serial numbers containing A158-1 main rotor spindle and A106 journals, certificated in any category

[rockymtnrotor]

First of all, read my posts again. I never criticized ercam1991. My posts are not constantly edited like someone else's. I did offer some suggestions in how to post. Never once is there negative criticism or name calling as he has done to several others.

 

Second, as others have said, the forum is not the place for posting reviews on schools or blatant name calling. There is a separate place just for that. And I stand by my post in the review. It is open for EVERYONE TO READ. You just stared there, and you have no idea what you're talking about. I will not get into any other name slinging in this thread. You and I have talked, and you know why I am dissatisfied with them. I'm sure they have their reasons for what they did, don't care anymore.

 

 

Would you mind showing me the link to the Premier school review?... I can't find it. Is it possible to start reviews of a school that is not listed. Where does a potential student get reviews of a school that chooses not to incude themselves in the review section? (as I suspect they don't include themselves) Serious questions.

 

So that is the only place to provide negative feedback on a school or experience? I thought the point was to get information out on pros and cons of experiences. Which, by the way, I know Premier has pros also. Lately they seem to be digging a grave and I think it behoves potential students to know the truth.

 

Second you have no idea of my hours or experience. I'm far from just starting. My bigest concern is that new and current students are getting information to make informed decisions. There have been several people within this post that have eluded to the problems at Premier and yet you seem to disregard every aspect of it. Are you just trying to defend them so you can make more money off of future contracts or do you really care about the new students who are coming into this industry?

 

Companies rarely change their name if they are under the same roof, paying their bills, operating under the same business structure and running a reputable business. It's called reputation... banks look for it, creditors look for it, and potential students should look for it.

[BOATFIXERGUY]

Second you have no idea of my hours or experience. I'm far from just starting. My bigest concern is that new and current students are getting information to make informed decisions. There have been several people within this post that have eluded to the problems at Premier and yet you seem to disregard every aspect of it. Are you just trying to defend them so you can make more money off of future contracts or do you really care about the new students who are coming into this industry?

 

Did I say you were a FNG? No. I said you were new "THERE." And again, as far as premier goes, I already said if they are doing things illegal they should be shut down. How is that promoting them? And I don't make money on them or with them. I used Kenton and Cayse to help with my ride contracts and tours when I needed more equipment. Already told you that. I actually tried to help them out with contracts...you know the part about companies helping other companies? Tried it with your company too. I'm not as good as them apparently, so they refused FREE money. I told you before, Kenton and Cayse were the guys I worked with, not Mike. Mike had to ok the arrangement, that's all.

[ercam1991]

Who cares if they changed their name? It doesn't protect them from liability. Name changes are common in business. As they grow or add services, a name change is sometimes required. Do you honestly think if they change their name it's to limit lawsuits? They are still Premier Helicopters in one form or another aren't they?

Thats incorrect.....just trying to help, not start a fight.

[Copterpilot213]

Hmmm. Well from what I gather the bottom line of this thread is:

 

1. There was a crash during a practice 180 auto and it was a Premier Helicopter.

2. There are a lot of mixed feelings about the school.

3. We're all glad the CFI and Student are ok and want to learn from what happened.

 

Guess I just wanted to bring back what I see as the real meat and potatoes of this thread...

 

-Jeff

[ercam1991]

Applicability: Model R22 series helicopters, all serial numbers containing A158-1 main rotor spindle and A106 journals, certificated in any category

Wow, your kidding right? Do you have any idea what we are talking about?

[ercam1991]

Hmmm. Well from what I gather the bottom line of this thread is:

 

1. There was a crash during a practice 180 auto and it was a Premier Helicopter.

2. There are a lot of mixed feelings about the school.

3. We're all glad the CFI and Student are ok and want to learn from what happened.

 

Guess I just wanted to bring back what I see as the real meat and potatoes of this thread...

 

-Jeff

Everything you said is true....The problem is the flight was from Colorado to Arizona in an aircraft that was passed its 500 hour AD inspection. Mike the owner of Premier knew this. He sent the CFI and the student to have the inspection done. The student gets to time build at a discounted rate. True, the CFI made a bad choice and had an accident...and that is not Mikes fault. The problem is the 500 hour AD. He sent them in a ship that is not considered airworthy. Insurance will not cover the damages....so Mike is asking the CFI to pay for the ship...yes I know, good luck in getting it from him. Mike Kelly of Premier Helicopters is a shady guy, who has very poor business habbits that contributes to things such as this....there is a long history here of how he screws people...there are law suits against him pending from CFI's, students, mechanics, owners of helicopters to name a few. And yes, companys have ups and downs and hard times....I understand this. But, your problems shouldn't allow you to screw others. As he has done many times over. So, word to the wise....do your best to avoid him. The CFII's in Denver.....they are great guys. Arizona location.....not so good. This is the meat and potatoes of this thread.

[Kelly N.]

Retard...I never said anything about a check ride...that is what was stated by the pilot involved in the accident. Now, if you just click and open my threads, I have been very clear. Don't you have a private pilot certificate to study for? You need to learn to read and think. I have a feeling this is way over your head. Perhaps you should join "The Hannah Montana Fan Club Forum"

 

 

Ercam,

 

You may be a veteran in this industry. You may be honestly representing the facts about Premier Helicopter. You may be someone who is rightfully chagrined about a school and business that you feel needs to be exposed so as to protect new student pilots and others in this industry.

 

However, the manner in which you have conducted yourself in this forum is unprofessional and raises questions about the integrity of your information and intent. You are distracting from any legitimate concerns you are raising (which should not be your intent if you are truly trying to protect others in this industry from a potentially shady operator).

 

Let me give you a few examples: using insults like "idiot", "retard", and implying that someone must be studying for their private pilot cert because they don't, in your opinion, understand your previous posts (nice regard for student pilots there) are all tactics that I would not expect or accept from a professional in any industry.

 

Your behavior has undermined your stated intent to protect this industry (at least on this forum which is definitely not like JH).

 

So you will understand my frame of reference: I am studying for my PPL. I am also a professional and a veteran in the telecom field. On top of that, I am also a veteran of the Armed services. Although I am not a veteran in this industry, I do know a thing or two about professionalism and integrity (despite being just a student-pilot).

 

I hope you reconsider your approach in the future and share your experiences and advice on this forum in a more professional and respectful manner (to the other posters and parties who are not present on the forum to represent themselves). If you wish to get into an mud-slinging contest, there are other forums that are more appropriate and even expect that sort of posting style that you should check out.

 

Safe flying,

Kelly

[Helo-Pilot]

I have been following this thread since it started.

 

What amazes me is that many veteran posters here have been sucked in by a troll. It is MY opinion, that Ercam is posting under multiple names, and it seems that his sole purpose here is to flame Premier and bait others into an argument.

[clay]

funny stuff. . . (not the crash. that sucks) but all the name calling. and if you guys dont quit it, i WILL tell mom. you meanie butt-heads

[Kelly N.]

I have been following this thread since it started.

 

What amazes me is that many veteran posters here have been sucked in by a troll. It is MY opinion, that Ercam is posting under multiple names, and it seems that his sole purpose here is to flame Premier and bait others into an argument.

 

 

It had occurred to me that this could be the case but, I wanted to give someone who might have insight for this forum the benefit of the doubt.

 

Obviously, it's a good thing if people report/discuss various businesses and potential bad practices but it's also usually a highly charged topic as well and emotions tend to boil over in some cases.

 

Some may have written Fry off initially (although I wasn't around when he first started posting, I've read most of the threads) and that seems like it would have been a mistake based on his contributions and how things have developed.

 

You are probably right but, I hope it's not the case and the forum could gain another perspective.

 

Kelly