military flight vision restrictions

[fuzzynumbskull]

hey fellow forum-ees.

 

i was wondering if anybody had any idea what the current restrictions are for pilots in the military as far as eyesight goes. i've heard of pilots with LASIK being able to fly for the army. the particular branch of my interest is the marine corps. do they take people who are uncorrect and worse than 20/50, but corrected can be 20/20 or 20/15? does any branch okay LASIK?

 

thanks for the time and the responses.

[Lindsey]

hey fellow forum-ees.

 

i was wondering if anybody had any idea what the current restrictions are for pilots in the military as far as eyesight goes. i've heard of pilots with LASIK being able to fly for the army. the particular branch of my interest is the marine corps. do they take people who are uncorrect and worse than 20/50, but corrected can be 20/20 or 20/15? does any branch okay LASIK?

 

thanks for the time and the responses.

 

 

Hey there! I'm currently going through the same thing - I'm looking to join the Army in about a year to fly helos. I have terrible eyesight, and researched the issue immensely. Unfortunately, it is VERY difficult to find concrete answers on such a constantly-changing issue, but I'll share with you what I've found so far, until someone else much more knowledgeable than I can confirm/update/deny what I've found.

 

The most recent document I've been able to find regarding this issue is Army Regulation AR 40-501 "Standards of Medical Fitness."

 

The document can be found here in PDF format. The relevant information is in Chapter 4 "Medical Standards for Flying Duty" on page 41. In case you don't feel like clicking the link and scrolling through 40 pages, here is what it says regarding near and distant visual acuity:

 

4–12. Vision

The causes of medical unfitness for flying duty Classes 1/2/2F/3/4 are the following:

a. Class 1. Any disqualifying condition must be referred to optometry or ophthalmology for verification.

(1) Distant visual acuity. Uncorrected distant visual acuity worse than 20/50 in each eye. If the distant visual acuity

is 20/50 or better in either eye, each eye must be correctable to 20/20 with no more than 1 error per 5 presentations of

20/20 letters, in any combination, on either the Armed Forces Vision Tester (AFVT) or any projected Snellen chart set

at 20 feet. (See ATB, Distant Visual Acuity Testing and APL, Decreased Visual Acuity.)

(2) Near visual acuity. Uncorrected near visual acuity worse than 20/20 in each eye; with no more than 1 error per 5

41

AR 40–501 • 14 December 2007

presentations of 20/20 letters, in any combination, on the AFVT or any Snellen near visual acuity card. (See ATB,

Near Visual Acuity Testing and APL, Decreased Visual Acuity.)

 

There is more than that regarding other vision disqualifiers, but the above text is the main part.

 

Vision worse than that is considered disqualifying. BUT! You can get LASIK/PRK and apply for a waiver. The latest document I've been able to find regarding eye surgery is unfortunately dated January 2006 and comes from the Idaho Army National Guard. It can be found here:

http://www.idahoarmyguard.org/ArmyAviation...aSurgeryAPL.pdf

 

That said, it is a very remarkable document detailing the procedure and process for getting a waiver (NOTE: Since this is coming from an Army National Guard source, the process very well may be different for Active or for the Marines).

 

Personally, I am at this point fairly certain I am going to get PRK instead of LASIK. Even though LASIK has a quicker recovery time, nearly instantaneous great vision, etc., it also carries with it a huge risk which is of the corneal flap becoming dislodged later due to a tramautic event, possibly culminating in loss of vision. This is extremely rare, but the reason that the Army was much more hesitant OKing LASIK than PRK. PRK surgery does not involve lifting the flap, so that particular risk does not exist.

 

All that said, I've been talking to several current Army Aviators on this board, some of whom have had LASIK and PRK. Their help has been immeasurable, and I highly recommend them if you have further questions.

 

Again, please note that all information I provided is possibly outdated, but it is the best I could find. Hopefully someone else can pull up some fresh regs.

 

Best of luck,

Lindsey

[Lindsey]

Okay, did some more research and went to the Ft. Rucker Aeromedical Site. Their most updated Refractive Surgery Fact Sheet can be found here:

 

https://www.rucker.amedd.army.mil/Refractiv...0Applicants.pdf

 

NOTE: It is still only from 2006, I'm not sure if they've changed it since then.

 

Here is a little fact sheet from Rucker regarding the differences between PRK and LASIK. Very basic, but it's from the source, so still helpful.

 

https://www.rucker.amedd.army.mil/Refractiv...and%20LASIK.pdf

[FLHooker]

Yup, it's official.... you know more on the eyesight requirements than I do.

 

Keep in mind, 2006 is PROBABLY not outdated for the Army. I say probably, cause I don't know for certain.

 

 

 

CHAD

[CharyouTree]

Okay, did some more research and went to the Ft. Rucker Aeromedical Site. Their most updated Refractive Surgery Fact Sheet can be found here:

 

https://www.rucker.amedd.army.mil/Refractiv...0Applicants.pdf

 

NOTE: It is still only from 2006, I'm not sure if they've changed it since then.

 

Here is a little fact sheet from Rucker regarding the differences between PRK and LASIK. Very basic, but it's from the source, so still helpful.

 

https://www.rucker.amedd.army.mil/Refractiv...and%20LASIK.pdf

 

Hey, sorry I didn't get back to you sooner on FB, I worked 18 hours yesterday. (Are you SURE you want to be an Army aviator? lol)

 

Hokay, so: Here is the APL for corneal refractive surgery (Feb 07). But, It's got ALL of the Aeromedical policy letters, so...I'll help you out.

 

https://aamaweb.usaama.rucker.amedd.army.mi...Ls_Mar08_v4.pdf

 

Once it's loaded up, use the search feature to look for ICD9 V802A/V802B The first search will be the table of contents entry, the next should be the actual APL. Any issues, let me know. You can also just scroll through until you're on page 208/368, but I'll leave that choice to you.

 

All the way through appendix four to get the required forms, and the "fact sheet for flight school applicants"

[Lindsey]

Yup, it's official.... you know more on the eyesight requirements than I do.

 

Keep in mind, 2006 is PROBABLY not outdated for the Army. I say probably, cause I don't know for certain.

 

Haha, thanks.

 

Hey, sorry I didn't get back to you sooner on FB, I worked 18 hours yesterday. (Are you SURE you want to be an Army aviator? lol)

 

Hokay, so: Here is the APL for corneal refractive surgery (Feb 07). But, It's got ALL of the Aeromedical policy letters, so...I'll help you out.

 

https://aamaweb.usaama.rucker.amedd.army.mi...Ls_Mar08_v4.pdf

 

Once it's loaded up, use the search feature to look for ICD9 V802A/V802B The first search will be the table of contents entry, the next should be the actual APL. Any issues, let me know. You can also just scroll through until you're on page 208/368, but I'll leave that choice to you.

 

All the way through appendix four to get the required forms, and the "fact sheet for flight school applicants"

 

 

...this is EXACTLY what I have been searching desperately for! Thank you so much! So much!

 

Cheerfully,

Lindsey

[fuzzynumbskull]

I already knew of the Army, you can pretty much get a waiver for anything with them... Not to be mean or hyperbolic or anything, but I bet if you were just a torso and a head and could find an army surgeon to waiver it, you could probably get away active duty.

 

Does entering branches such as Marine, Air Force, Coast Guard with PRK already done (assumption is you are within/exceeding their parameters for visual acuity tests) disqualify you from a pilot seat (means you can only be a navigator)?

 

Personally, I don't want to be a navigator when I can be a pilot. Kind of like settling for a piece of chicken when you can have filet mignon or a kobe steak cooked by Wolfgang Puck.

[Lindsey]

I already knew of the Army, you can pretty much get a waiver for anything with them... Not to be mean or hyperbolic or anything, but I bet if you were just a torso and a head and could find an army surgeon to waiver it, you could probably get away active duty.

 

Does entering branches such as Marine, Air Force, Coast Guard with PRK already done (assumption is you are within/exceeding their parameters for visual acuity tests) disqualify you from a pilot seat (means you can only be a navigator)?

 

Personally, I don't want to be a navigator when I can be a pilot. Kind of like settling for a piece of chicken when you can have filet mignon or a kobe steak cooked by Wolfgang Puck.

 

You obviously don't know much about Army Aviation if you think just anyone could get in.

[wopilot]

I already knew of the Army, you can pretty much get a waiver for anything with them... Not to be mean or hyperbolic or anything, but I bet if you were just a torso and a head and could find an army surgeon to waiver it, you could probably get away active duty.

 

Does entering branches such as Marine, Air Force, Coast Guard with PRK already done (assumption is you are within/exceeding their parameters for visual acuity tests) disqualify you from a pilot seat (means you can only be a navigator)?

 

Personally, I don't want to be a navigator when I can be a pilot. Kind of like settling for a piece of chicken when you can have filet mignon or a kobe steak cooked by Wolfgang Puck.

 

 

And I definitely don't want you as a Warrant. Your attitude sucks and you need to stick with Robinson helicopters. Good luck finding help from anyone on this site.

[FLHooker]

I already knew of the Army, you can pretty much get a waiver for anything with them... Not to be mean or hyperbolic or anything, but I bet if you were just a torso and a head and could find an army surgeon to waiver it, you could probably get away active duty.

 

Does entering branches such as Marine, Air Force, Coast Guard with PRK already done (assumption is you are within/exceeding their parameters for visual acuity tests) disqualify you from a pilot seat (means you can only be a navigator)?

 

Personally, I don't want to be a navigator when I can be a pilot. Kind of like settling for a piece of chicken when you can have filet mignon or a kobe steak cooked by Wolfgang Puck.

 

 

Not only does his atttitude suck, but I have yet to see a 'navigator' in a helo. Might want to research a lil' more there champ.

 

Also, I find it humorous that people 'outside' of Army Aviation say that just anyone can get in... then why aren't you?

[Lindsey]

Not only does his atttitude suck, but I have yet to see a 'navigator' in a helo. Might want to research a lil' more there champ.

 

Also, I find it humorous that people 'outside' of Army Aviation say that just anyone can get in... then why aren't you?

 

Yeah, what he said regarding Navigators is like the equivalent of going to the WOFT board and saying "This will ensure I'm definitely a pilot, right? Like, I don't want you to stick me as an enlisted crew chief or something when I can be a pilot. Kind of like settling for a piece of chicken when you can have filet mignon or a kobe steak cooked by Wolfgang Puck, you know?"

 

They would have a field day, I'm sure.

[fuzzynumbskull]

i didn't mean to be disrespectful, and i apologize to anybody i offended... i did not mean to disrespect army aviators.

 

obviously a person would probably not be a navigator for a helo. my concern was that (hypothetically) if a person had to head off to school and had bad eyevision but also had PRK done that they would only be offered a navigator seat on a fixed wing due to their eye vision.

 

i've known a few navigators they enjoyed the job, but personally i cannot see myself enjoying the job. i just wanted to know if there was a chance.

 

i wish you luck in the field of military aviation and i again apologize for being an a**hole.

[Lindsey]

Not to hijack the thread, as I'm sure this still pertains to the Marines, etc., but does anyone know if the regulations change as to the different TYPES of PRK and LASIK?

 

For example, this big LASIK company in the Northwest discusses a couple of advanced LASIK treatments called intralase LASIK and Customvue Wavefront.

 

Here is the link:

 

http://www.restorevisioncenters.com/html/procedures.html

 

I'm a bit lost, again.

 

Thanks.

[CharyouTree]

Not to hijack the thread, as I'm sure this still pertains to the Marines, etc., but does anyone know if the regulations change as to the different TYPES of PRK and LASIK?

 

For example, this big LASIK company in the Northwest discusses a couple of advanced LASIK treatments called intralase LASIK and Customvue Wavefront.

 

Here is the link:

 

http://www.restorevisioncenters.com/html/procedures.html

 

I'm a bit lost, again.

 

Thanks.

Bearing in mind that all my experience stems from PRK (realistically, I didn't even get as far as to research LASIK... I just wasn't interested):

 

The wavefront is STILL LASIK or PRK as the case may be. The difference is that it's more...precise. The exact verbage that I recall is it helps "eliminate higher order aberrations". The gist being that you'll be less likely to have issues with the procedure, as it's more customized to the individual. Think the difference between an off the rack suit (dress) and one tailored for you. You pay extra, but it's theoretically worth the cash. I personally went for it. I wanted to take no chances, just for being frugal.

 

Your best bet is to talk with your potential surgeon about all of the options available to you. It shouldn't cost a dime to get consults. Get as many as you want until you're comfortable. There aren't many options to fix mistakes in this situation.

[fuzzynumbskull]

i remember googling "Military PRK aviation surgery" and seeing a list of the visual acuity parameters someplace (just a warning that the stuff on google can be about 8-9 years old and outdated) ... Also, if you head towards getting surgery in the private sector, make sure you go to a really good doctor but you probably already know that you shouldn't trust just anyone with your eyes.

 

this is outdated but does have some information: http://usmilitary.about.com/od/theorderlyr...asersurgery.htm

 

edit: PRK takes longer to heal and has a slightly worse success rate. if you don't like PRK and can get it waivers you might consider going for a branch that allows LASIK... especially if your vision is naturally horrendous. LASIK has the higher success rate and works on the much worse eyesight.

 

i'm not an ophthalmologist or an optometrist, so be sure to talk to a few of them because they know eyes. i have heard of LASIK patients having restrictions on going up to certain altitudes, but that may be an urban legend or a thing of the past.

 

also: here is a side by side comparison of PRK and LASIK http://www.prk.com/LASIKvsPRK.html

Edited October 5, 2009 by fuzzynumbskull

[FLHooker]

Fuzzy,

 

No worries man, just relax and think about what you are putting on here.

 

As for the navigator slot, I can't speak for the other services, as their processes are different. However, for the Army, before you are selected to attend WOCS and Flight School, you will be given a Class 1 Initial physical. At that point, you would know if you pass the physical or not. If you do, you put your packet in front of an interview board. The only options would be selected, qualified non select, and not qualified. Can't be offered a 'navigator' slot for the Army.

 

 

 

CHAD

[akscott60]

I just passed my flight physical after undergoing PRK surgery back on May 17th of 2009. The only small hurdle I experienced was at MEPS. They told me they required a 6-month wait after eye surgery, where as the army told me 3 months. Regardless, I needed a waiver, which was approved in less than 24 hours.

 

When my flight surgeon submitted my physical it was sent flagged as "unqualified" or something due to my PRK. He told me not to worry, its just procedure.

 

My flight doc sent it in on Friday at around 11am, and Rucker approved it by Wednesday of the following week.

 

If you want this bad enough, get your eyes zapped, and get with it. I have been wanting to fly for the military my entire life.

[Lindsey]

I just passed my flight physical after undergoing PRK surgery back on May 17th of 2009. The only small hurdle I experienced was at MEPS. They told me they required a 6-month wait after eye surgery, where as the army told me 3 months. Regardless, I needed a waiver, which was approved in less than 24 hours.

 

When my flight surgeon submitted my physical it was sent flagged as "unqualified" or something due to my PRK. He told me not to worry, its just procedure.

 

My flight doc sent it in on Friday at around 11am, and Rucker approved it by Wednesday of the following week.

 

If you want this bad enough, get your eyes zapped, and get with it. I have been wanting to fly for the military my entire life.

 

Wow! Seems the process went fairly smoothly, then. I'm going for LASIK or PRK as well. What made you personally choose PRK? How was your recovery?

[akscott60]

The process went much smoother than I thought it would have. I chose PRK due to a couple of factors. Surface ablation surgeries do not change the structural integrity of the eye. LASIK will when they do the corneal flap. When the cut the flap, they also bisect nerves that trigger eyes to water, so if you have dry or dryish eyes, it will get worse. The nerves grow back, but never fully. My corneas were fairly steep as well, which a couple of doctors told me makes me a better PRK candidate.

 

My recovery was this:

Day 1, surgery. Get zapped, no pain, go home, sleeping pill, eye drops, sleep 6 hours.

Wake up, eat, drops, pills, sleep again.

Day 2, Wake up, see pretty awesome. Pills, drops, go to doctor. He looked at the progress, and I went home. Pain started to set in. Pills, drops, eat, sleep another 8 hours.

Day 3, vision got poor (which happens). Pain was still present. Slept most of the day.

Day 4, vision got worse, but pain went away. Friend took me out for a hamburger. I ate it with my eyes closed. Drops all the time.

Day 5, No pain, less drops. See the doctor. Remove the bandage contacts. That hurt. Lots of drops.

Day 6-14. Vision got better. I drove 8 days after the surgery.

Day 14-50. Right eye went to 20/10 after 2-3 weeks. Left eye lagged at 20/30ish until almost 2 months after surgery. Then one day it was 20/20.

 

Now, 6 months or so later, eyes get drops every couple of hours. Its awesome to wake up and see, and more awesome for eyesight to no longer hold up military aviation dreams.

 

Wow! Seems the process went fairly smoothly, then. I'm going for LASIK or PRK as well. What made you personally choose PRK? How was your recovery?

[Lindsey]

I just passed my flight physical after undergoing PRK surgery back on May 17th of 2009. The only small hurdle I experienced was at MEPS. They told me they required a 6-month wait after eye surgery, where as the army told me 3 months. Regardless, I needed a waiver, which was approved in less than 24 hours.

 

I think my recruiter is also hearing about this 6-month wait thing for MEPS. How did you get around that, because yeah, it looks like it is only a 3 month wait for the Flight Physical? Yet you have to do the MEPS physical first.

[SBuzzkill]

I was selected in March 2009 with my vision being 20/70 in one eye and 20/60 in the other, uncorrected.

 

My near vision is 20/20 and corrected with glasses I am 20/20. I talked with the FS at the conclusion of my physical and he said that he would send my packet to Fort Rucker even though I was outside of the regulation. He said that sometimes they are very strict "20/50 no worse," and other times they are "ehh, close enough."

 

I had to wait a month for Fort Rucker to approve my physical.

 

I have had another flight physical since then (the one given at Fort Rucker prior to starting Flight School) and scored 20/40 uncorrected. Fancy that!

Edited February 3, 2010 by SBuzzkill

[gizmo85]

Hi Everyone,

 

I've been lurking the forums for a while now - my husband is in the process of applying for the WOFT program, and he just spoke to his recruiter today for the first time about it (he was overseas until this week).

 

He had LASIK done a few years ago and after reading the forums I believed it wasn't a big deal. When we got to the office, the recruiter first today said LASIK was a definite disqualifier. After I told him about what I read - that LASIK requires a waiver but that it's not a big deal - he bet me a case of beer I was wrong and phoned someone up. That person told him to "go for it" with my husband, but the recruiter is still saying that my husband needs all the LASIK pre and post-op info before going for his MEPS physical.

 

Does anyone know if that's true - do you need the pre and post-op info when you go to MEPS or do you need it when you go to get your class 1A flight physical, or at both times? Also, how do you go about getting a waiver? Do the people at MEPS do that, or does the flight surgeon do that, or does the recruiter do that?

 

I only ask because he's scheduled to do his MEPS physical on Wednesday, but we won't be able to get his LASIK info for another week, and he doesn't want to reschedule for no reason.

 

On a side note, thank you, everyone, for all the information you've provided on this forum. It has, by far, the most up-to-date information I can find on the internet regarding WOFT for civilians. Good luck to all of you hoping to make it in!

[akscott60]

When your husband is projected to MEPS for his basic enlistment physical, he will be flagged for LASIK. Tell him to bring all the paperwork if he can. The actual waiver will be given by Ft. Rucker aeromed after he gets his flight physical. He will need color topographic maps of his corneas, as well as 3 post-op checkups on paper.

[BillyBob]

Do the research YOURSELVES. Do NOT rely on an NCO recruiter he is not a Medical Doctor.

Here is the Army Website with a reference and link to LASIK information.

 

http://www.usarec.army.mil/hq/warrant/WOov...AST%20Locations

 

Good Luck.