Need some help

[sallen]

I am trying to gather information on getting a pilots license.

 

I have made up my mind this is what I want to do and I want to plan accordingly.

 

Right now I'm going to college at Texas Tech and there are no heli flight schools near me.

 

There is one 5 min from my home, Epic in Arlington, my thought is to start next summer and finish in the fall hopefully, I will take some college courses at a junior college so I don't fall behind in my college schedule.

 

After I get done and back out to college I might try and work for some of the local helicopter businesses' in the area to build hours and get experience.

 

What should I do between now and then?

 

I've researched a little and understand most of the requirements, what is the FAA written test like, what do I need to be familiar with, etc.

 

As I understand it I will need a commercial license, I plan on flying/owning an R22.

 

I am looking for any advice or tips.

[67november]

well you come to the right place. all of your questions have been asked and answered before, you just need to do some research and reading

[Inferno]

Hi and welcome.

 

First of all, your schedule looks too tight. On average, it can take someone more than a year to get finished with their CFI attending class full time. The best i have seen or heard of is 6 months, but that is incredibly rare. One summer would be enough to get you through your Private and a little into your Commercial or Instrument. But nowhere near the 150 hours for your commercial or 200 to instruct.

 

And I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I find it highly unlikely you will be able to find a piloting job with

 

If you are really serious, start studying now. That will save you a lot of time on the training process if you already understand the concepts. Buy the Rotorcraft Flying Handbook, Pilot's Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge, and a couple others people will recommend and read them cover to cover.

[sallen]

This is what I was wanting to know.

 

From what I can understand, why would I need more than the private+commercial?

 

What does the instrument give me...is it worth 14K?

 

I plan on buying, or leasing, at first and starting my own company eventually. Not exactly looking for a job flying for oil/gas companies using their equipment.

 

I could also get some FW hours out here in Lubbock this fall and next spring if that would help me get on my way.

 

Where would I get the handbooks you just mentioned, do they contain all the knowledge I need to pass the FAA test?

 

Thanks for you input.

Edited October 14, 2009 by sallen

[adam32]

This is what I was wanting to know.

 

From what I can understand, why would I need more than the private+commercial?

 

What does the instrument give me...is it worth 14K?

 

I plan on buying, or leasing, at first and starting my own company eventually. Not exactly looking for a job flying for oil/gas companies using their equipment.

 

I could also get some FW hours out here in Lubbock this fall and next spring if that would help me get on my way.

 

Where would I get the handbooks you just mentioned, do they contain all the knowledge I need to pass the FAA test?

 

Thanks for you input.

 

What will you be doing with an R22 if your not doing instruction? Pretty much have to do at least some instruction to get your hours built...a commercial doesn't mean much to the insurance companies...

[ADRidge]

This is what I was wanting to know.

 

From what I can understand, why would I need more than the private+commercial?

 

What does the instrument give me...is it worth 14K?

 

I plan on buying, or leasing, at first and starting my own company eventually. Not exactly looking for a job flying for oil/gas companies using their equipment.

 

I could also get some FW hours out here in Lubbock this fall and next spring if that would help me get on my way.

 

Where would I get the handbooks you just mentioned, do they contain all the knowledge I need to pass the FAA test?

 

Thanks for you input.

 

It sounds like you have a decent enough plan for having barely started down this road. If you've got the time and bucks, I'd go get started on your FW ratings up there in LBB. 90% of the stuff you'll learn will transfer over to helicopters, and some of those hours will count toward your rating in helicopters as well.

 

The instrument rating basically teaches you how to fly solely on instruments in essentially zero visibility conditions. Not having this knowledge, and getting stuck in bad weather, you've got minutes to live. Yes, it's worth 14k. It also helps you get used to thinking five, ten minutes ahead and doing quite a bit of multitasking, as well as maybe making you a bit smoother on the controls.

 

And the poster above me who mentioned that insurance companies don't really care too much about a straight commercial rating... he's right. I just talked to Sutton James about insurance for an R-44 Raven 1, valued at around 340k. With 198 hours or so and a CPL, I can expect to pay 33,000 a year for insurance.

Edited October 14, 2009 by ADRidge

[Sparker]

This is what I was wanting to know.

 

From what I can understand, why would I need more than the private+commercial?

 

What does the instrument give me...is it worth 14K?

 

I plan on buying, or leasing, at first and starting my own company eventually. Not exactly looking for a job flying for oil/gas companies using their equipment.

 

I could also get some FW hours out here in Lubbock this fall and next spring if that would help me get on my way.

 

Where would I get the handbooks you just mentioned, do they contain all the knowledge I need to pass the FAA test?

 

Thanks for you input.

 

Not to say we won't help you here, but you would do well to set up a meeting or call a couple flight schools and chat. You will probably get your questions answered faster and get to know the attitude and friendliness of potential schools. I took a weekend off when I was first interested and spent it at the flight school talking to instructors, students and the owner.

 

You will need your CFI maybe CFII rating. Instrument rating allows you to fly without reference to the ground, in poor visibility. It is a highly competitive job market and without all the ratings, you better have really good friends that can hire you to fly for them.

 

The FAA written test is a multiple choice, time limited test. There are "Test Prep" books that have every question in them, and sample test online. Go through those books and memorize every question and answer. You might not fully understand what they are at the time, but it is just rote memorization. Start doing this now, it will save you a ton of time later. If you can't make it through that, don't expect it to get easier.

 

Good luck

[r22butters]

You can download the Rotorcraft Flying Handbook, for free, from the FAA.gov site. As for the written tests, try the ASA Prepware, you can study/take practice tests on your computer. It works great, that's how I passed all of my written tests. Most importantly, you don't need to be working with an instructor to take these tests. Once you get a high enough score on the practice test, you can e-mail it to ASA for the endorsement. Also, by a POH for the R22, and start studying it, you can get one at either a local flight school, or by calling Robinson.

 

I would have to say, an Instrument Rating is not worth the money! However, you probably won't be able to get a teaching job without it, and if you cannot teach, you won't get a job!!!

[Inferno]

I'm sorry butters, but I disagree. Yes, most of us will never need to use it (instrument rating), but it helps to have it in the bag. It made me a hell of a lot better at maintaining altitude and heading, and improved my ability to communicate with ATC drastically.

 

Also, I'm not sure where people keep throwing out this $14k figure from. When I did my instrument, I did it between my private and commercial. It maybe added $4k to the cost (for the r44 trainer time) but that all fell in the same time I needed to get my 25 hours of 44 time anyways.

 

And yes, if you want a job, you need an instrument rating. Simple as that. Its just an added layer of safety for a potential employer, should you inadvertently fly into clouds.

 

As far as FW, I recommend it. It may do nothing to help you get a job, but it will increase your total time offer you a cheaper way to fly in your free time.

 

Times are tough right now. Helicopters cost a lot of money, even when they aren't flying. Do not buy a helicopter thinking you will just be able to find work for it without really doing your research and figuring out the market. I've seen quite a few people try that and fail. I don;t mean to sound negative, but i'm just trying to help you see the realty.

[arotrhd]

I'm with Inferno regarding the Instrument rating for the reasons he listed, + inexpensive life insurance. Remember, it doesn't always have to be IMC conditions to induce spatial disorientation. The Instrument rating helps develop & reinforce proper reactions and behavior and you will be a tighter pilot. Even better, ask an instructor to take you on an "IFR discovery" flight, preferably at night...grab a -22/-44/other helo with a simple IFR training package (no using SAS or A/P if it's got it), get & stay under the hood, and see how fast sh!t can go from bad to worse and how fast the helo wants to get away from you. When you're back on ground and done cleaning your shorts, thank the instructor for not letting you stall or overtorque. Then you might be convinced it's worth the time you're going to need to build anyways.

 

-WATCH FOR THE WIRES-

[r22butters]

There have been a number of accidents involving "inadvertant encounters with IFR" where the pilot was instrument rated, they talked about some of them at the safety course. It seems having an instrument rating gives some pilots the overconfidence to fly through, or below, bad weather, even in VFR only helicopters. We had one around here not to long ago, they both died trying to fly below the fog!

 

My instrument training didn't "make me a better pilot", as many schools, and insurance companies lead people to believe. I learned enough about IMC to decide its just not worth the risk! Keep in mind, an IFR pilot will look at crappy weather and say, "how can I get through, or around this?", a VFR pilot will look at it and say "weather sucks, I'll fly tomarrow."

 

I seriously doubt anyone will agree with me on this issue, however, helicopter pilots did just fine for decades without instrument ratings, I know, I've met, and flown with several of them.

 

My simple definition of an instrument rating is this, "how to take the fun out of flying!" If I wanted to fly in the clouds, I would have become an airline pilot.

[Inferno]

Aah, but you missed one very important thing. How many of thoes pilots were current instrument pilots? I've probably read the same NTSB reports as you. I clearly remember one of them, where the pilot held an instrument rating, and the last time he had flown in sim IFR was 10 years before. And if someone takes an instrument cert as a license to dick around with clouds in a VFR ship, they are idiots and what happened was probably inevitable. Sorry man, but the idea that an instrument cert is bad because people will be more likeley to fly into clouds seems completely irrational.

 

Oh, and ya, Its boring. I hated the last 10 hours of it. But that "boring" 40 hours of sim IFR could very well save my life one day. A lot of what we do is boring or tedious. Do you put off a preflight because you think its boring? No, probably not, because that 15 to 30 minutes of tedious and boring preflighting could very well save your life.

There have been a number of accidents involving "inadvertant encounters with IFR" where the pilot was instrument rated, they talked about some of them at the safety course. It seems having an instrument rating gives some pilots the overconfidence to fly through, or below, bad weather, even in VFR only helicopters. We had one around here not to long ago, they both died trying to fly below the fog!

 

My instrument training didn't "make me a better pilot", as many schools, and insurance companies lead people to believe. I learned enough about IMC to decide its just not worth the risk! Keep in mind, an IFR pilot will look at crappy weather and say, "how can I get through, or around this?", a VFR pilot will look at it and say "weather sucks, I'll fly tomarrow."

 

I seriously doubt anyone will agree with me on this issue, however, helicopter pilots did just fine for decades without instrument ratings, I know, I've met, and flown with several of them.

 

My simple definition of an instrument rating is this, "how to take the fun out of flying!" If I wanted to fly in the clouds, I would have become an airline pilot. <_>

[r22butters]

I don't think an instrument rating is "bad", I just think its overrated. And besides, I've known VFR pilots who have gotten through IMC encounters just fine. I definitly don't think that having one will save my life, nor do I think that not having it would kill me. By the way, I didn't say it was "borring", I basically said it sucks!

[Wally]

There have been a number of accidents involving "inadvertant encounters with IFR" where the pilot was instrument rated, they talked about some of them at the safety course. It seems having an instrument rating gives some pilots the overconfidence to fly through, or below, bad weather, even in VFR only helicopters. We had one around here not to long ago, they both died trying to fly below the fog!

 

My instrument training didn't "make me a better pilot", as many schools, and insurance companies lead people to believe. I learned enough about IMC to decide its just not worth the risk! Keep in mind, an IFR pilot will look at crappy weather and say, "how can I get through, or around this?", a VFR pilot will look at it and say "weather sucks, I'll fly tomarrow."

 

I seriously doubt anyone will agree with me on this issue, however, helicopter pilots did just fine for decades without instrument ratings, I know, I've met, and flown with several of them.

 

My simple definition of an instrument rating is this, "how to take the fun out of flying!" If I wanted to fly in the clouds, I would have become an airline pilot.

 

Dude/Dudette, I'm one of those old farts who did the job for decades without the instrument rating (I had the training), and I buried a lot of colleagues who didn't have the training, or weren't up to the challenge when they needed it. Like the gun cliche "It's better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it"- I recommend the training, or as much as you can get, even if you don't see the need. A serious professional in most of this industry's realms will need the training at some point- or should think about other work. I can't speak to utility or AG, but for anything else you do, you will at some point be grateful for those skills.

 

Those skills saved my butt many times, and not just in IIMC scenarios. IIMC is enough in and of itself to justify the training, but you learn weather, physiology, airspace systems, etc., for the rating. After all, if you're going real live IMC on purpose, you want to know more about weather than a VFR guy needs. Once you're "white windows" the process is bloody serious, you don't just put it in a field somewhere...

 

No, I won't 'push' because I have the training. Quite the contrary, IFR training is condensed experience and technical knowledge for those who are smart enough to use it judiciously. If you don't, well, Darwin Award for you, eventually.

 

Instrument training is the best life insurance in the world for a professional pilot- it pays off by keeping you alive. Once is enough to justify the modest expense.

Edited October 14, 2009 by Wally

[gmsemel]

Well I did My helicopter certificates and ratings as add on's to my fixed wing certificates rating I held at the time. this was in 1982-83. I did the Instrument Helicopter and Instrument Helicopter Instructor. It didn't take much I had 12 hours under the hood in a Bell 47 and I when for check ride. The way it worked out, was that the school I when to, sent 6 guys for the ride before me, they all busted the ride. The fellow that owned the school talked to me the day before the ride that It would be bad for the school, if I bust the ride too. A little pressure. The FAA showed the next day and the oral when ok, and then the ride. When and did the ride, came back to the base, and they were all hanging around well did you bust the ride, I said no I didn't it when well spot on every thing. Ok my instructor said we can now get the CFII done and you will be finished. I said that will not be possible, he will not do a CFII ride with me. The owner of the school asked why, I said because I already gotten it done, he gave me the CFII too. That shocked them the FAA dose not do that or that guy dose not do that. Now back to the question in hand, there was no doubt being a rated instrument rated airplane pilot helped me in spades, I could spend time flying the helicopter because I knew Instrument procedure. Doing the instrument rating in an Airplane is a smart thing to do, but what the other said is valid points, you need helicopter time to fly helicopters. As for getting to use the instrument rating, well in my case, the last instrument approach I made in a helicopter was the NDB into Salem OR in June of 1983. I have never used the instrument rating as a helicopter pilot, this is not to say having it didn't keep me out of trouble. I have never flown a helicopter that you could take actual anyway so its a moot point. Now I got plenty of actual IFR in Airplanes. Of course the kind of IFR you can do in an Airplane is a no go in a helicopter, mostly to do with icing. But you need the thing, so buck up and have fun with it. I found that ride to be one of the most enjoyable and easiest check rides I ever taking

Edited October 14, 2009 by gmsemel

[brettjeepski]

Welcome to the Rotor world. My advice is to visit lots of schools and ask a lot of questions. Check out a lot of schools websites and learn as much as you can. I am a current student at an awesome flight school in northern utah. I get some awesome mountain flying experience up here. They have a pretty good website too. http://www.MountainRidgeHeli.com

You can google other flight schools then just compare a lot.