Thoughts on an Inadvertent IMC Course...

[jeffh0214]

First and foremost, as a long time reader and rare poster, I would like to thank all of the active message board participants for the time they spend sharing their knowledge on this site. I've been an avid reader all the way from my private training through CFII and I still frequent this site many times a day.

 

Anyways, my employer approached me recently and asked if I was interested in putting together an Inadvertent IMC Course. I know of a few flight schools out there that already have a course like this in place, but I still thought of getting everyone's opinions on this site.

 

The course would essentially consist of 2 hours of ground training, 1 hour of training in our Fly-It sim, and 2 hours of flight training in the R-22 or R-44.

 

The ground training would provide a basic understanding of aircraft instrumentation related to IFR flight, a discussion on how to properly maneuver the helicopter in the event of an IMC encounter, how to properly recover from unusual attitudes, and weather conditions in which an inadvertent IMC encounter is most likely to occur.

 

The sim training would consist of basic flight maneuvers with reference to the instruments, VMC to IMC flight, 180 degree turns in IMC with both full and partial panels, and navigation using the Magnetic Compass.

 

The flight portion would consist of basic hood work, inadvertent IMC recoveries, unusual attitude recoveries using both full and partial panels, and navigation using the Magnetic Compass.

 

The course would be geared more towards those who don't have an instrument rating, but would be a good refresher for all pilots.

 

My course outline is still a work in progress, but I just wanted to get everyone's thoughts on a course like this and whether they think it would generate enough interest. Any opinions, comments, or ideas would be greatly appreciated. Thanks...

[RkyMtnHI]

Hey Jeff,

 

i think this is a great idea, both for instrument rated pilots (refresher) and others as well. We have talked about this a lot. We have an instructor that has around 22,000 hours fixed wing international flying and were thinking of having "IMC days" so to speak. When the weather is bad have everyone that is available come in and either fly with him in a sim or in a fixed wing instrument ac and even into the mountains to see what it's like.. i have flown a 182 in IMC and it's a real eye-opener to say the least.

 

We have even talked about having a real instrument rated helo in the future but don't really know if its practical or even feasible.

 

dp

[JDHelicopterPilot]

Don't forget to include IIMC prevention. I would also look more in depth into the phycological aspects of how pilots get into such situation and how that leads to Controlled Flight Into Terrian. I think a bigger focus on IIMC and how it leads to CFIT would be better.

 

Are pilots prepared ahead of time for an IIMC encounter? For example, do they have approach plates with them? If a pilot goes IIMC and declares an emergency with ATC and there aren't any VFR conditions around for him to be vectored to then he'll be stuck shooting an approach.

 

These accidents are happening because the pilot doesn't accept the fact that he has gone IIMC and wants to keep decending and slowing down to maintain VFR as long as possible. The pilot reaches a point where it then becomes to late.

 

What you are suggesting right now(IIMC recovery,unusual attitude,navigation and use of compass) is something that is should be covered already in the Instrument Rating.

 

My personal opinion is that there needs to be a bigger focus on the actual decision making process that leads to IIMC and CFIT accidents. A lot of these accident pilots had lots of flight time and even if they were not "high time" pilots they had instrument ratings. Yet they still ended up crashing. Some were even in a fully outfitted IFR capable twin. Why?

 

Food for thought.

 

JD

[Mikemv]

The idea that 180 degree turn gets you out of IMC conditions is not the best or most valid solution. Initially a straight climb to a safe altitude will get you safe from towers, wires, CFIT, etc. and is the easiest IMC maneuver to accomplish. This also increases your ability to commo with ATC.

 

I do agree that not getting into IMC thru IIMC is the path of training that is most important. Good, sound decision making is the key. This skill can be taught and emphasized. The 180 degree turn prior to IIMC is a good decision. Not having flown in potential IIMC conditions is even better.

 

Be Safe, Mike

[Pohi]

I agree with mikemv when he talks about decision making, and I would like to add my two cents about flight planning. Learning how to get out of the poop is great, not flying into the poop that is in front of the aircraft is even better, but many times a simple check of the weather will save the pilot from even getting the aircraft into the air at all.

 

I realize that checking the weather before a flight sounds like common sense, but sometimes it is not that common at all.

 

I am also guilty of not checking weather. I have not been able to check the weather for quite a while because the replacement string for my weather rock is on back order.

[kodoz]

I don't think I've flown an R22 that was equipped to survive an IIMC encounter, so Mike and JD are right on--the problem is in the decision-making process that leads to IIMC. CRM and ADM are some of the most neglected subjects (just look at where they are in the RFM)--it wasn't until I took an HAI course that I really saw the value in most of the basics of ADM/CRM.

 

To get you started, this is an article I wrote based on a JH Original Forum discussion that followed one of the IIMC/CFIT incidents earlier this year. I'd appreciate it if you contributed to the site's knowledge base if you find it useful. One thing we could really use is a helicopter-specific PAVE or personal minimums checklist. I've asked many instructors how they developed their personal minimums, and the answer was that they make it up as they go. Isn't that what gets pilots in trouble? I've also seen the "personal minimums calculators" that AirLog uses...why isn't something similar introduced during primary training...?

[Marc D]

Quote: "These accidents are happening because the pilot doesn't accept the fact that he has gone IIMC and wants to keep decending and slowing down to maintain VFR as long as possible. The pilot reaches a point where it then becomes to late. "

 

I think the best preventative IIMC training I have ever had and have continued now for 18 years is reading accident reports. Old ones, new ones, and every one in between. 18 years ago this is what my dad told me to do, and I'm certain it has molded my attitude. Unfortunately it has made me a pessimist; but I'm alive, I'm safe, and I'm appropriately confident.

 

As far as a "short course", I do believe this was the intent of the 10 hours required for a commercial rating.

 

Marc D.

[r22butters]

kodoz

Today, 11:58

I don't think I've flown an R22 that was equipped to survive an IIMC encounter,

 

I knew a guy who got into it once in an R22. He used the AI to make a 180, and did just fine.

 

Come to think of it though, I've flown about 26 of those little things, and only 5 had anything you could use for IIMC. I hear the new glass cockpit one is great.

 

The course sounds like a good idea too.

Edited December 1, 2009 by r22butters

[aclark79]

There is certainly a difference between someone who admits they are about to go IFR and prepares themselves mentally and physically (getting on the guages before loosing ground reference). Of course avoiding the IMC conditions is preferable, but this is a class for the worst case scenario right? There is a big difference between going IMC when you've prepared for it and going inadvertent IMC and you should make sure you train for both things, if you are going to have this course.

[JDHelicopterPilot]

aclark79,

 

I said preparing for IIMC not IFR. You are right there is a big difference between IIMC/CFIT and IFR flying. However, you can prepare for the worst case situation in such a way that if it did happen you could be best prepared to handle it.

 

Some ways to do so is as you said, keep up on the basic IFR skills. However, let me ask this, how many of you have approach plates with you when you fly for the airports along your route or service area? Having those with you is such a basic thing and could go along way in having a good outcome.

 

I have always been of the belief that AVIATION DECISION MAKING and COCKPIT RESOURCE MANAGEMENT are sorely lacking in training. We must as pilots evaluate what we do and the decisions we make. All that needs to be done is to identify one link of many in the chain of events leading to an accident. Doing so will prevent that accident.

 

As an EMS pilot in a very rual area it can be hard sometimes. My flights are often almost 300nm round trip with areas that have no weather reporting. So, I have to rely on my skill, experience and judgement.

 

I know I say it a lot, just goes to show how strong I feel about it, ADM needs to be taught and covered much more than it is now. ADM also can not be completly taught as some of it comes from experience. As such I try to read the accident reports on a monthly basis and learn from other pilots.

 

JD

[aclark79]

aclark79,

 

I said preparing for IIMC not IFR. You are right there is a big difference between IIMC/CFIT and IFR flying. However, you can prepare for the worst case situation in such a way that if it did happen you could be best prepared to handle it.

 

Some ways to do so is as you said, keep up on the basic IFR skills. However, let me ask this, how many of you have approach plates with you when you fly for the airports along your route or service area? Having those with you is such a basic thing and could go along way in having a good outcome.

 

My post was not meant as a critique of your earlier post. I think there can be some confusion of terms here, so I'll clarify what I mean. What I mean is that there is a difference between going IMC when your not ready for it because you haven't accepted that your screwed and going IMC when you accept its going to happen and preparing for it before by getting on the instruments.

 

I do keep approach plates for the area I'm flying in with approaches, even though I don't fly an IFR ship. Its not something I would use except in an emergency after things had gotten so bad that I went IMC. Things would have to be pretty bad for that to have happened.

[JDHelicopterPilot]

No worries. It's just a topic I am very passionate about. I've lost friends in the past from doing stupid things such as taking off at night and trying to land at an airport that was in LIFR conditions. Not a good outcome.

 

I am glad to see you keep approach plates. Even if it's not a IFR aircraft. If you have a GPS/Nav radio and an HSI then you can shoot an approach. It may just be enough to get a pilot out of the weeds should they not be able to be vectored to VFR conditions by ATC.

 

JD