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jeff.f
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I am interested in hearing from Schweizer owners/operators and having you give your thoughts on what they do well, how you would like to see them operate, what problems you encounter with service from them, their parts systems (availability, ease or not of working with them, speed of customer service, etc. etc.), warranty work - so in general, how you like working with Schweizer. Also include ideas, if you can, about; parts life, mechanical issues and other topics. I talked with one owner and one of his complaints was about a SB that ended up costing him about ten grand only to find that he would have had no problem from its effect and not only was he out the money but also had verrry poor support from his "qualified" service center. The good , the bad and the ugly. Feel free to let me know. Thanks. I would appreciate if you reply to me at:

 

jeff@qualitywithwings.com

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Dont worry about all that trash just buy a R44 you cant go wrong with that unless your a Sh*t pilot.

 

They are two different classes of helicopter. I'll take a 300 over a 22 any day of the week. As for the 44, if Frank would put REAL helicopter controls in them I might consider it. Plus your remark about being a 'sh*t pilot' was uncalled for and out of line.

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They are two different classes of helicopter. I'll take a 300 over a 22 any day of the week. As for the 44, if Frank would put REAL helicopter controls in them I might consider it. Plus your remark about being a 'sh*t pilot' was uncalled for and out of line.

 

 

I have flown both the 300 and 22 entirely to much. The 300 is a horrible machine with constant down time and slow forward speed. The 22 is known as (if you can fly it you can fly anything helicopter) and is a reliable machine. Whats not REAL about the T Bar cyclic? You hold it in almost the same position as a traditional cyclic if not a more convienant placement on your leg. Being in a hiring position I would consider a 22 pilot over a 300 pilot with the same amount of hours simply due to the finesse required to master those controles. How about the 22 with its superior TR authority and fuel burn as compaired to the 300. Robbie haters need to get over the fact that the cyclic is different then what they currently fly. In the entry level helicopter industry helicopter control is everything. Forget the big turbine or advanced avionics for a second and think about what really matters for employers at this stage.

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Schweizer's web site is intact (for now) with "a subsidiary of Sikorsky Aircraft" added... most of the Schweizers I have flown are really Hughes Aircraft anyway... Remember Nissan by Datsun? It seems like a valid question about the 300, not what else is out there or what to fly besides the 300. I like the 300 and find it well suited to the market it was designed for... Learning... I just hope someone can answer the question for Jeff.f. Just my two cents!

 

As for Rotorbreak, there are other posts that have gone on forever about the virtues and lack of for the Robbie, try posting your vast experience there and let Jeff.f get his info without starting a side post about the Robbie. :blink: :blink:

Edited by Snowman
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Jeff,

 

I have flown the schweizer for about 800 hours. I think it is a great machine. It is very well suited for the training environment. It is a nice stable platform for shaky students to practice in. It is a very forgiving machine too. For training I would go with a 300CBi unless you are looking for a higher altitude aircraft. In this case get a 300C model. More power in that one.

 

I used a 300C in the mountains in cali. It performed very well (although it wasn't the best maintained machine). I used it for training and commercial applications such as photo flights and aerial surveys. With the C model you can take 2 people as the PIC sits on the left. I had it up at 6500DA and maybe more with a Nat Geo photographer and we were both very happy with it.

 

The downside to them is that they are maintenance pigs, for want of a better word. There is always an oil leak or something small wrong once you get over 1200 hours, definitely 1500. You will certainly pay more in maintenance than you will on a 22 or 44.

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The downside to them is that they are maintenance pigs, for want of a better word. There is always an oil leak or something small wrong once you get over 1200 hours, definitely 1500. You will certainly pay more in maintenance than you will on a 22 or 44.

 

While I agree with the oil leak issues and such on the 300, I am not so sure about the fact that you will pay more for maintenance on the 300 then you will on the 22 or 44. While the maintenance is certainly spread out over the life of the machine on the 300, every 2200 hours you are paying a very big chunk (half the cost of a new machine?) for the 22 and 44 overhaul. Also, please correct me if I am wrong but isn’t there a life expectancy on the robbies? Something like 12 years I heard where the machine is then scrap metal..?

Please note I am not trying to start a 300 vs. 22/44 war here, just stating something in reply to the message above..

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Something like 12 years I heard where the machine is then scrap metal..?

Please note I am not trying to start a 300 vs. 22/44 war here, just stating something in reply to the message above..

 

First, I did not mean to send this post off on a wild tangent with my Sikorsky comment...it kinda went downhill after that. So, I'm glad to see some real 300 posts in here. There are several really well versed pilots on the 300 on this forum, I am not one of them..so guys, speak up.

 

As far as the Robbies, the 12 year inspection does exist. However, are you not going to put 2200 hours on the ship in 12 years anyway? (Thats only 15 hours a month, we fly ours 100 hours a month!) So when you do your 2200 hour overhaul, the 12 year cycle resets and starts over. On the R22 it works out around $50 an hour that you set aside. If you figure $60 an hour that would cover your total maintenance cost...if you fly it nice.

 

The 22 does require more touch to fly. I think it makes for some good pilots, but if I was in an area flying around a lot of mountains or turbulence, or wind gusts, I would rather be in a 300 as it much more stable. At least for those initial 30 or 40 hours where every little bump scares the crap out of you!

 

Fly safe,

 

Goldy

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Hi Jeff,

 

We fly 300s and R44s.. any of my team can give you detailed info on both platforms.. we currently operate one of each and are flying them about 100 hours each per month. I have direct operating experience on six different 300s and three R44s and would be happy to spend some time with you on the phone discussing this topic...

 

I personally love both ships.. i only have five hours in an R22 but would have one or two if we weren't at 6k'. I'm not saying that i'd give up my 300s, i don't think there is a better trainer out there.. but i would love to have an R22 in the fleet as well! :-)

 

You can call me at the office or send me a pm and i'll send you my cell number..

 

good luck,

 

dp

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Hi All,

Thanks for the feedback thus far. I suppose I could have better directed this question more towards the maintenance operations. I am not trying to decide which ship to use. I had hoped to get feedback on issues like interaction with "Schweizer" end of Sikorsky's business.

 

As In: Their R/O return order system, parts warranty, timeliness, rotable parts and parts tracking, supply chain issues. These are the types of areas I wanted to know more about from owners.

 

 

I already went to SOG (yeah,,,, thats schweizer owners group). Not a lot of feedback yet.

 

Thanks again

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Hi All,

Thanks for the feedback thus far. I suppose I could have better directed this question more towards the maintenance operations. I am not trying to decide which ship to use. I had hoped to get feedback on issues like interaction with "Schweizer" end of Sikorsky's business.

 

As In: Their R/O return order system, parts warranty, timeliness, rotable parts and parts tracking, supply chain issues. These are the types of areas I wanted to know more about from owners.

 

 

I already went to SOG (yeah,,,, thats schweizer owners group). Not a lot of feedback yet.

 

Thanks again

 

 

yep, can tell you all about that... better ask for me or Garin tho..

 

dp

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Guest pokey

like they say: "if yer not part of the solution, then ya must be part of the problem"

 

I've been working on & flying 300's since 1989 & dealt w/ plenty of mechanics, service centers, and Schweizer themselves. All in all? i think everyone i ever dealt with was trying to do their best. Sometimes it worked out well, & other times it could have been handled better. Most of the tech-reps at Schweizer over the years were very knowledgable & easy to work with on my problems. Parts procurement was usually pretty good too. My biggest complaint?----parts just cost tooo much ! and most every time you send parts back to the factory for inspection/repair, it ends up costing more than you thought.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am interested in hearing from Schweizer owners/operators and having you give your thoughts on what they do well, how you would like to see them operate, what problems you encounter with service from them, their parts systems (availability, ease or not of working with them, speed of customer service, etc. etc.), warranty work - so in general, how you like working with Schweizer. Also include ideas, if you can, about; parts life, mechanical issues and other topics. I talked with one owner and one of his complaints was about a SB that ended up costing him about ten grand only to find that he would have had no problem from its effect and not only was he out the money but also had verrry poor support from his "qualified" service center. The good , the bad and the ugly. Feel free to let me know. Thanks. I would appreciate if you reply to me at:

 

jeff@qualitywithwings.com

I just sold a cbi that we took delivery on at the factory in late 2006. Working with Schweizer was above average. I was very suprised that the warranty only covers parts. They offer an extended warranty and was glad I checked that box. It has been over 3 years of education in flying/inspections/repairs. If you are new to the helicopter thing all I can say is some will rob you with a 6 gun and others with a fountain pen.

In 3 years the most valuable lessons learned is who you can trust and how to read the service centers. Pay the best and flush the rest. Its been great and would without question purchase another 300.

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