The Importance of Networking

[Spike]

I'll tell you why anonymity is preferred. I've had irate posters from various web boards call my employers repeatedly in attempts to get me fired (they've stated as much: it was their way of trying to get "even" based on their perception of what they read on a web board).

 

Frankly, nobody here is worth that much concern, and frankly, anonymity is just fine. If the words aren't good enough for you, then no amount of credential behind them will make any difference.

 

Agreed…… X10…….

 

And, I’ll add, internet credibility is never worth the effort.....

 

Edited April 27, 2013 by Spike

[iChris]

 

Christ may be the wrong one to pick as a networking specialist. Your picture shows him with his disciples; we're all aware of his fate in the days following the last supper (suffering to the point of sweating blood, and death by crucifixion). He picked disciples to assist in his work, much like an employer picks employees. The benefits were not good, the hours very long, and the pay non-existent.

 

The disciples certainly didn't pick Christ as a networking opportunity. Their upward mobility was stimied by fates such as inverted crucifixion and death by conflagration. Not good for them. The key moment of the depiction in the last supper was a point of betrayal by Judas, with identification of the traitor and his designation as such by Christ.

 

The whole event (and those surrounding it) are more of an anti-networking statement, if anything.

 

 

The plan from the beginning was for sacrifice (the blood of Jesus), remember John 3:16

 

The disciples were people who chose to follow Jesus and to listen to his teaching. They were followers of Jesus whom he had chosen to become his core group.

 

What we know of the disciples is that they all left their livelihoods and commitments to follow Jesus as he traveled around the country, preaching, teaching, and healing.

 

The disciples task was to be the rock on which the church was to be build upon.

 

Ultimately, Simon-Peter became the leader of the Christian movement in Jerusalem.

 

The networking was successful.

 

Merriam-Webster

Networking - the exchange of information or services among individuals, groups, or institutions; specifically: the cultivation of productive relationships.

Edited April 27, 2013 by iChris

[nightsta1ker]

 

Agreed…… X10…….

 

And, I’ll add, internet credibility is never worth the effort.....

 

 

 

I can relate to that.

[Counterrotate]

 

 

Merriam-Webster

Networking - the exchange of information or services among individuals, groups, or institutions; specifically: the cultivation of productive relationships.

And history repeats itself...

[avbug]

 

You don’t network, so what is you opinion on some of the so-called Seminars and networking events that are promoted here on Vertical Reference like theHeliSuccess Career Development Seminar.

Is it of any benefit?

Is it just another revenue generating activity?

 

 

 

I haven't been to it, so it would be inappropriate for me to speculate. The answer will lie in the value perceived b y each participant. If someone goes to it and gains something or takes something away they can incorporate into their career, then it's probably quite worthwhile.

 

If you're asking if it's a great networking opportunity, I can't say. I don't attend those events as a rule.

 

I've attended job fairs, where one goes to meet employers. One lines up outside the door, presents the resume in hand to a recruiter, and undergoes an initial screening or interview. I don't know if helisuccess is the same way or not.

 

I approach a job search with some effort. I research the companies to whom I'm employing. On ones I'm targeting I gain a lot of intel; everything from their stock trends to profiles on the company management, details on their fleet, history, news clippings, questions asked in interviews, and interviews with those who have interviewed there before. The biggest research project I did involved a company which by most accounts had one of the toughest aviation job interviews in the world; I spent nearly seven months compiling a prep file for that company, and it was over six hundred pages thick by the time I was done.

 

I systematically approached each interview topic and question, and researched every one. Any places I lacked in knowledge or understanding, I did additional research and collected information. I also bought books to cover some of the areas, and read them, taking notes, highlighting, and underlining. Other employers I've put in less effort; one of my last employes was only a 45 page brief, with another 100 pages of supporting documentation. There was little that I could have been asked in the interview that I didn't know at that stage, and I was able to go to the interview feeling fairly prepared. I approached each potential employer at a job fair the same way, with customized resumes and cover letters, and a dossier or brief prepared for each.

 

These are things that can be taught at a job seminar, as well as proper methods for interviewing, resume formatting, and a host of other things. I've been amazed to see the lack of preparation some take in coming to an interview, from the dress to the paperwork. I recently saw someone nearly lose their job as a result of such preparation; they'd already been hired, but their inability to account for flight time properly nearly resulted in loss of the job.

 

I would have given my wife an AR-15 for home defence....

 

 

 

I have a number of them at home, but that's a topic for another time and probably a different web board. I have several safes full of firearms. The shotgun was for my wife, and it's one of a number that are in my safe(s), from full tactical setups to a pistol-gripped 12 gauge with an 8" bbl chambered for 3 1/2" magnums. We don't lack for preparation.

 

 

 

The disciples task was to be the rock on which the church was to be build upon.

Ultimately, Simon-Peter became the leader of the Christian movement in Jerusalem.

The networking was successful.

 

 

 

 

 

Bartholomew was beheaded, after crucifixion and beating. Mathew was killed with a sword, and Thomas with a lance. James (of Alpheus) with thrown off a precipice, then beaten to death. James (of Zebedee) was beheaded with a sword. Andrew was bound to death. Simon was crucified. Thaddeus died by arrows. Phillip was also crucified. Judas of course hanged himself, while John was only banished to an island.

 

Peter was crucified, upside down (at his request).

 

Successful networking all around. Let's hope that no applicants from this board end up in the same situation as a result of networking. Perhaps not the best example for a successful network, or conclusion of a career, unless someone here is pursuing martyrdom.

[Goldy]

 

You don’t network, so what is you opinion on some of the so-called Seminars and networking events that are promoted here on Vertical Reference like the HeliSuccess Career Development Seminar.

 

Is it of any benefit?

 

Is it just another revenue generating activity?

 

That is the single best networking event in the US. About 20 pilots of the 200 there leave with a new job. I don't know any other event that makes that happen. In addition, interviews are done on the spot, and names are added to a future wait list....those pilots usually get hired out in 3-4 months.One of the largest tour operators hires a huge percentage of their pilots throughout the year from this one event. But don't take my word for it, in fact, anyone who hasn't taken the time to go shouldn't bother. Makes it easier for everyone else!

 

Networking is just such a waste of time and effort. Easier to just fax out resumes all day.

[avbug]

Networking is just such a waste of time and effort. Easier to just fax out resumes all day.

 

 

No, it's not easier to fax resumes all day, but it's not necessary to do that.

 

A little research and preparation makes the difference.

 

Perhaps it's the gotta-have-it-now, entitled generation today that feels the easy way is the best way.

 

It's not always about the easy way.

[pilot#476398]

Perhaps it's the gotta-have-it-now, entitled generation today that feels the easy way is the best way.

 

That must be why so many these days network, because it's the easiest way to land a job. All you have to do is be freindly!

[iChris]

 

Bartholomew was beheaded, after crucifixion and beating. Mathew was killed with a sword, and Thomas with a lance. James (of Alpheus) with thrown off a precipice, then beaten to death. James (of Zebedee) was beheaded with a sword. Andrew was bound to death. Simon was crucified. Thaddeus died by arrows. Phillip was also crucified. Judas of course hanged himself, while John was only banished to an island.

 

Peter was crucified, upside down (at his request).

 

Successful networking all around. Let's hope that no applicants from this board end up in the same situation as a result of networking. Perhaps not the best example for a successful network, or conclusion of a career, unless someone here is pursuing martyrdom.

 

 

That’s correct, it was very successful all around. This was an excellent example of successful networking. Many died advancing the Christian movement. They were a group of individuals that cultivated productive relationships toward the task of establishing the church on which to continue the teachings of Jesus Christ. That’s a key element of networking; it brings about cohesiveness between individuals with common goals. These men were willing to die for the advancement of Christianity. Therefore today, from the sacrifice of men like these, we’re free to warship without fear of death.

 

Through networking they built a committed following as they traveled around the country, preaching, and teaching. The cohesiveness was so strong it took on life itself. When these men died, there was always someone in the network that picked-up the cross and continued on. They buried the man and continued the plan. That’s 2,000 years of success, an excellent example of the power of networking. Christianity still stands.

[avbug]

Christianity still stands.

 

 

So fractured and changed as to be nearly indistinguishable from what once was. So much so, in fact, that when one says "I'm a Christian," it tells us nothing, because of how diverse the term has become. We're not really here to talk about Christianity, are we?

 

Definitely not about networking. Christianity, by definition is a relationship between a believer and Christ, not between believers and their friends. Unless one develops a personal testimony of the truthfulness and divinity of that in which one professes belief, one is simply a blind follower, and no religion exists. Networking exists for those who have no faith. It's entirely unnecessary if the "gospel" is the truth. One cannot convert another. It's not possible. That's a change that takes place from within, and has no relationship to fellowship or networking. Christianity is a poor example for those who would network, unless they seek to be junior terrorists or martyrs in the making.

[gary-mike]

I am saddened by the turn this forum has made lately. From the Kingsford commercial about winter "Someone get these men a burger". The cold and white is gone, work is sure to start soon, lighten up and enjoy life. I've heard from multiple other people that they no longer see much value in coming to this site due to the way the threads have gone. That sucks, considering how valuable I have found this forum to be in the past.

[gary-mike]

Oh yeah, about Heli-success, don't go, it is awesome but, If only the pilots that have the drive to move on show up the hiring will be much easier for the companies that need good pilots. One of the speakers last year said something along the lines of "help other people, but keep some cards in your pocket". Well I feel one of mine is this event so don't waste your time, stay home and better my odds...(when the time comes).

[pilot#476398]

I am saddened by the turn this forum has made lately. From the Kingsford commercial about winter "Someone get these men a burger". The cold and white is gone, work is sure to start soon, lighten up and enjoy life. I've heard from multiple other people that they no longer see much value in coming to this site due to the way the threads have gone. That sucks, considering how valuable I have found this forum to be in the past.

 

Maybe its a generational thing (I'm 40ish) but I just come to internet forums for their entertainment value, so I don't really mind this kind of "off-topic" bullshit. It's way more interesting than all that WOFT stuff, or the videos of "look how cool MY job is"! Don't get me wrong, if I know something that someone else is struggling with, I'm more than happy to share what knowleadge I have, but I don't really see the internet as a "valuable" reasource. It's just a place for opinions!,...and this is mine.

 

What does pilot #476399 think?

[Nearly Retired]

gary-mike:

 

I've heard from multiple other people that they no longer see much value in coming to this site due to the way the threads have gone.

 

Well, this thread alone has nearly 2,000 views, which I'd say is pretty decent, and which tells me that people are coming to this site for something.

 

People always make that same complaint: "Oh, I don't visit that site anymore because the threads are (insert criticism here). They're usually the ones who a) don't start any threads, and don't participate in any. Nevertheless, they do not find the existing threads satisfactory in some way. Seems to me a tad immature.

 

There is a crew of "usual suspects" who post here regularly, gary-mike among them but we all know the others. These are guys who consistently offer the rest of us thought-provoking things. Others prefer to lurk, obviously. When a lurker complains about a website, it always annoys me just a little. It's not even like complaining about bad TV shows; you can't do much about them. On the other hand you can do something about these threads: Start a new one! Add something constructive to an existing one! DO something instead of just sitting and complaining about the situation. I hate that.

 

But finally, let's keep in mind that this is just the internet. I know, I know, we pilots try to hold ourselves to a "higher standard" than other, mere mortal internet posters. But the truth is that we're just humans trying to make it from day to day in this world. And in the grand scheme of things, this little internet site ain't all that important (no offense, Lyn!). I often see posts by guys like Avbug, and maybe the rest of you think he's some sort of God, but I see him as a pompous blowhard. Mostly. Yeah, he's been around since Christ was a Corporal, and he's got a breadth of knowledge and experience that is unreal. But that doesn't mean he doesn't get full of himself from time to time (like...always). Hey, we all do.

 

For the most part, I like this site and I like these threads, even the ones I do not participate in. (Some people probably like those the best.) Much better than that British site with those insufferable boobs who think every air ambulance helicopter should be two-engine, two-pilot, fully IFR with autopilot. God, they're such nitwits.

 

So bottom line: If you don't like the weather here, change it!

[rjl2001]

For the up and coming instructor, one of the best investments is a book by a fixed-wing instructor called Greg Brown. The book is entitled The Savvy Flight Instructor, and Greg has long been an advocate of networking. Greg recommends it not just for future use, but for finding students; using the ones you have now to get more, to make contacts, to spread word-of-mouth advertising, and so on. Every instructor should own a copy of that book.

 

I just happened to see that book in the library the other day and I agree it seems to be a very worthwhile read. I ended up standing there close to an hour reading it before I put it back. Thanks for mentioning it, this reminds me that as soon as I'm done with this next check ride coming up and have some free time I need to go back and finish reading it.

[Nearly Retired]

rjl2001:

 

I just happened to see that book in the library the other day and I agree it seems to be a very worthwhile read. I ended up standing there close to an hour reading it before I put it back.

 

An hour?! Man, I can't stand for that long. So I do most of my reading sitting down. I usually choose a "chair" in the smallest room in the house, the one with the biggest echo. And now with my iPad, I can take VR in there with me! And you know, some of the posts on here make me so mad I could just sh*t, so...it's kind of like a win/win. Luckily I don't sing while in there (and if you've ever heard me sing you'll know why)...although that doesn't mean there aren't other, um, "sounds" reverberating off the walls.

 

What! TMI?

[arotrhd]

gary-mike:

 

 

Well, this thread alone has nearly 2,000 views, which I'd say is pretty decent, and which tells me that people are coming to this site for something.

 

 

 

So back to networking.

Can anybody recommend a good IT guy?

 

 

By the way, I can't recall the last post on VR that involved aviation, religion and gubs. Can we bring some politics soon?

 

 

 

 

-WATCH FOR THE PATTERNS, WATCH FOR THE WIRES-

[gary-mike]

I do try to add to a thread when I feel I can, sometimes I butt in when I shouldn't. As far as changing weather, I have neither the hrs or the certification to use that kind of power ;-) I think the thread had a good message and good intent, the arguments that followed are just extra bs to scroll past. If two highly qualified professionals want to bicker about religion and who can pee farther on an international forum and people see entertainment in that then so be it.

[Counterrotate]

I just think its overwhelmingly sad that someone who fancies themselves as such a grizzled old pro could be so unprofessional. The taunts, the threats, the ridiculous rants. I expect so much more from true professionals. Granted, I stooped to their level by arguing, but face it someone has to throw the flag down when they see a poor play. I don't like the idea of NR sitting on his holier than though high horse and putting people down who don't deserve it. Lets humor him for a second and assume there is a God up there judging us. What myself or anyone else believes is between us and God. NR needs to butt out and mind his own damn business. What anyone else believes or doesn't believe is none of his. I'll play nice if he will and let bygones be bygones. Just leave the belief system out of it please.

[Nearly Retired]

Well there's where you're wrong, Counter. I don't "fancy" myself as a grizzled old pro. I *AM* a grizzled old pro. My quals are out there, as is my actual name. And yours? Yeah, that's what I thought, Mr. Anonymous Internet Poster. I've earned the right to be crotchety. I've been around the block, seen all the bullsh*t this industry has to offer, and met more dumbass pilots than you ever will if you live to be 100. If that somehow troubles you, again, tough! I. Don't. Care. At least I try to maintain a sense of humor about myself and life. Some people, it seems, don't.

 

I have not made "religion" an issue in this thread, other than referring to it self-referentially and humorously. It was you overly sensitive pind*cks that brought up the whole atheism argument again and ran with it. Can't you guys let an issue lie? Right, didn't think so.

 

And another thing, Counterrotate, YOU are not the forum Moderator-In-Chief. YOU do not judge what is or what isn't acceptable to post. Not in this thread, not on this board, nor on ANY board that I would care to read. Got that? Good.

 

So have your fun putting me down for my beliefs, while pretending that yours are "better" than mine or that the whole issue is irrelevant. Screw that! My bygones are not your bygones, my boy, not by a long shot.

[Nearly Retired]

Here's what's in our friend Counterrotate's profile. This is what he tells us about himself:

 

GroupMembers

• Active Posts: 200
• Profile Views: 48
• Member Title: VR Veteran Poster
• Age: Age Unknown
• Birthday: Birthday Unknown
• Gender
  Not Telling

And *you* want to criticize *ME*?? That's a laugh. You're a nobody.

[Counterrotate]

Here's what's in our friend Counterrotate's profile. This is what he tells us about himself:

 

GroupMembers

 

• Active Posts: 200
• Profile Views: 48
• Member Title: VR Veteran Poster
• Age: Age Unknown
• Birthday: Birthday Unknown
• Gender

  Not Telling

And *you* want to criticize *ME*?? That's a laugh. You're a nobody.

Convenient, that's about all I want you to know about me! How about that? Yes, I am a nobody. You on the other hand, are a clown with aviator wings. I don't need my name out there. I don't want anyone looking me up. You act like that somehow makes my posts less relevant. Like seeing your retarded Facebook rants lends you any credibility. Yes, I looked you up, just for grins. I sure hope at least half of what you write is sarcasm. Just keep in mind, it doesn't translate well in writing.

[Nearly Retired]

Counterrotate:

 

Convenient, that's about all I want you to know about me! How about that? Yes, I am a nobody. You on the other hand, are a clown with aviator wings. I don't need my name out there. I don't want anyone looking me up. You act like that somehow makes my posts less relevant.

 

It's no act. Yes, it does. Makes your posts irrelevant, that is. Why don't you people realize this: Anonymity does not confer authority, no matter how loudly you yell something or what qualifications you imply. Your posts have all of the authority and value of those from a basement-dwelling teenager. THIS IS THE INTERNET where anyone can be anything.

 

Ohhhhh, wait, here's the excuse: You don't want anyone looking you up. What a guy. What a genuine positive asset to aviation you are! Not. Don't worry though; I'm sure that others with an interest in aviation would never think of "looking you up" for anything, especially career advice.

 

Me? I don't care if you consider me a "clown with wings." Your validation is not necessary for my happiness because I don't really care what basement-dwelling teenagers think of me. Even ones who aren't teenagers anymore.

 

Don't you some Xbox games to go play? Now run along and let the adults talk.

[CPL123456]

Interesting topic..

[pilot#476398]

Counterrotate:

 

 

It's no act. Yes, it does. Makes your posts irrelevant, that is. Why don't you people realize this: Anonymity does not confer authority, no matter how loudly you yell something or what qualifications you imply. Your posts have all of the authority and value of those from a basement-dwelling teenager. THIS IS THE INTERNET where anyone can be anything.

 

Ohhhhh, wait, here's the excuse: You don't want anyone looking you up. What a guy. What a genuine positive asset to aviation you are! Not. Don't worry though; I'm sure that others with an interest in aviation would never think of "looking you up" for anything, especially career advice.

 

Me? I don't care if you consider me a "clown with wings." Your validation is not necessary for my happiness because I don't really care what basement-dwelling teenagers think of me. Even ones who aren't teenagers anymore.

 

Don't you some Xbox games to go play? Now run along and let the adults talk.

 

As another irrelevant, anonymous, poster, I can see your point. As far as you (or anyone else) know, I could be a 16yr old virgin, up in my room, sitting in my game chair, wearing a Star Trek uniform, flying an Xbox, or a 50yr old truck driver in Baton Rouge simply killing time while I wait for a shower stall to open up, or a chick!

 

So, just how many members are there here on VR who aren't anonymous, and therefore not irrelevant?