cburg Posted October 9, 2014 Report Share Posted October 9, 2014 What burg says about A&Ps is very true. However the tradeoff is that once you have a flying job that requires an A&P by your employer, you get to fly all day and wrench all night only to find yourself flying early the next day then repeating the process. I think the other advantage for him is that he can get on the payroll (albiet small) early on while logging mech time. Many guys I know (my neighbor is one) got to gain some flight experience (some loggable) as part of his mech duties in the fairly early stages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted October 9, 2014 Report Share Posted October 9, 2014 Helicopter Class Add-on info: http://helicopterflight.net/Add%20on.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle5 Posted October 9, 2014 Report Share Posted October 9, 2014 What kind of jobs does a commercial gyroplane do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted October 9, 2014 Report Share Posted October 9, 2014 What kind of jobs does a commercial gyroplane do?Instruct...and a pathway to Helicopter. The few certified gyros can be used for some helicopter type functions, but it's rare. Here are a few viable designs (but funding problems) I'd love to have a Hawk 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCEYfW8DyxQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw8TIFENPuc and the old18-A http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzL0d3c-zuI There are many really nice gyros that have been certified in every country except the US. Here they are flown as Experimentals. A few examples: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baDtRdXt4X4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AptB9l-ajSA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vc_WyeTqbhM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csmvRhYh3Dc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPjAp-Y08Eo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 At the initial school I attended, they sold me on the “fixed wing add-on” as a cheaper method to building PIC time. In hindsight, for me, it was a waste of money. In fact, it burned enough money so I couldn’t finish my commercial helicopter certification. Over the next 10 years, I scraped, earned, finagled and borrowed (credit card) enough to finish my commercial and CFI………… A&P and gyrocopter educations cost money. If the ultimate goal is a pro-helo- jock, why waste the money? Associating with aviation doesn’t have to cost a dime. Then again, if you’re not EARNING money, then associating with anything is ultimately costing you………… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av619 Posted October 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Could not find the spicific thread but I think most is here: Some threads on saving money on ratings and time building, etc. Review of "building hours and ratings cheap"http://www.rotaryforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18873http://www.rotaryforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37014http://vps.zoniehosting.com/~rotary/forum/showthread.php?t=39717&page=2http://www.rotaryforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28574http://www.rotaryfor...ead.php?t=14485 http://helicopterforum.verticalreference.com/topic/15050-buying-your-own-helicopter-to-do-your-traing-in/ http://helicopterforum.verticalreference.com/topic/17545-experimentals/Thank you for your time to look all of these up! I will read up on it as saving money is something that I could really use! as far as buying a helicopter i do not think i could get a loan for that and if i did you just have to pay a cfi? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av619 Posted October 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 I took a loan out for all of my training. If there was an option that allowed me to train rapidly and have no debt i would have took it. Approximately how long ago did you do this? How has it been finding jobs? did you get hired as a CFI by your school? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av619 Posted October 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Sure, it took a few years but looking back I was miles ahead of the guys who had huge student loans, had gained valuable work experience to fall back on and used that as a spring board to open aviation doors that never would have opened otherwise. how would you be able to get any other job just because of you level of debt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av619 Posted October 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 You could always try to land a job at a helicopter operation if there is one near you; fueling, sweeping the hangar, loading for an AG operation, etc. That way you will at least be in the helicopter environment and able to learn a lot about the business while you are saving for training. If you get lucky, you might even score a few flight hours from time to time.I work at an FBO, although I fuel a few helicopters and move one in and out of the hangar daily i have not gotten any stick time! I have gone up in an MD530 and we did a max performance take off then auto'ed down and it was a freaking blast!!!! I took an intro flight about a month ago and i felt like i did pretty good on the R-22 controls but it left me wanting allot more!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 I work at an FBO, although I fuel a few helicopters and move one in and out of the hangar daily i have not gotten any stick time! I have gone up in an MD530 and we did a max performance take off then auto'ed down and it was a freaking blast!!!! I took an intro flight about a month ago and i felt like i did pretty good on the R-22 controls but it left me wanting allot more!!! As an A&P things are much better...and both doors remains open and the beginining pay is better too. If I were in your shoes, I think I'd go that route. I know several A&Ps who get stick time (some loggable). A fresh CFI that's an A&P has a big edge over just a fresh CFI in competing for a job...IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying Pig Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 But the issue a lot of times is what are they actually hiring you to do? An A&P who gets "some loggable time" is going to have a long road ahead if their goal is to be a pilot. The A&P school where I am is an 18 mo program that's about $20K. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleman202 Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Approximately how long ago did you do this? How has it been finding jobs? did you get hired as a CFI by your school? I started my training in 2007. My school did hire me as a CFII. Looking back since I was planning on going the CFI route to build time I should have looked for a school that was much busier! As it was, after I got hired as a CFII there was basically no work to be done. Through a different route I got a job as an Ag-pilot and am now doing that full time. I got extremely lucky with that job and am very blessed to have it. It pays the loan payments that it took to get there. If you seriously want to be a pilot and if you understand the possible consequences of having a lot of debt starting your career out, then taking out a loan for all of the training will get you through the training the quickest. I would have a really good employment plan planned out as best you can for after training. Including several part time or full time jobs to aid in income. Feel free to private message me or call if you would like to! 3092580948 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
av619 Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 I started my training in 2007. My school did hire me as a CFII. Looking back since I was planning on going the CFI route to build time I should have looked for a school that was much busier! As it was, after I got hired as a CFII there was basically no work to be done. Through a different route I got a job as an Ag-pilot and am now doing that full time. I got extremely lucky with that job and am very blessed to have it. It pays the loan payments that it took to get there. If you seriously want to be a pilot and if you understand the possible consequences of having a lot of debt starting your career out, then taking out a loan for all of the training will get you through the training the quickest. I would have a really good employment plan planned out as best you can for after training. Including several part time or full time jobs to aid in income. Feel free to private message me or call if you would like to! 3092580948 Thanks for the great advice and i will definitely keep you in mind for any questions! I seriously am stoked to have you as a reference, most pilots are good guys but you are really going the extra mile!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle5 Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 A "different route"...? Hmmm? Married a girl who's father owns an AG company? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aeroscout Posted October 17, 2014 Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 A "different route"...? Hmmm? Married a girl who's father owns an AG company? You might be thinking of that as a blessing.Try thinking of it as a curse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleman202 Posted October 17, 2014 Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 A "different route"...? Hmmm? Married a girl who's father owns an AG company? I'm not that smart! I actually just happened to walk into my local fertilizer and chemical co-op and asked if they would ever be interested in using helicopters for their aerial application. My purpose was to see if there was enough interest locally that I could maybe start a business someday. The owner of the plant said that they had actually been wanting to do their own aerial spraying in house. After about ten min on conversation he asked if would come work for them and start that side of their business. And now here I am. Like I said, lucky, right place right time. There was definitely someone higher up looking out for me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted October 20, 2014 Report Share Posted October 20, 2014 (edited) I paid for half my training with savings and half with a student loan from Sallie Mae.I had a previous career before becoming a helicopter pilot so I took out my retirement savings very early and took out a loan for the rest. I have a great credit score but Sallie Mae told me I did not have the history to get a loan. My Mom cosigned and I was disapproved a few times before finally being approved despite her literally almost perfect credit score. We did have to reapply several times but eventually got it. I would venture to guess you will need a cosigner if you want to go with Sallie Mae. I paid off interest while in flight school and for a while after that before starting to pay off the actual principal. I am very happy with my choice to take out a loan rather than wait and save up more money or pay as I go (but remember, I had about half of it already). I finally have a reasonable paying job flying now and can pay off interest plus some principal, pay my bills, have fun, and save some money for some upcoming adventures. It took time and effort (and some luck) to get to this point and it was painful at times but I just kept moving forward one step at a time and will continue this process while having fun the whole way through! I also have a friend who took out a Sallie Mae loan for all of his training (he had a very good cosigner), didn't get a flying related job for over a year after graduating and then finally got an internship that paid very little to do ground work and management at a helicopter company with the benefit of flight hours and time building. He worked/works really really really hard and always has an amazing positive attitude despite some of the 'bad luck' he has had in the industry. He has now gained enough hours to move into a flying position at that company which he is about to start doing just that soon (almost 2 years after graduating). He was always happy with his choices. Margot Edited October 20, 2014 by Mad Dog 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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