Bell 505 question?

[chris pochari]

What's the cylinder on the top of the bell 505 rotor hub?

[adam32]

Probably something for testing since it's still Experimental.

[chris pochari]

Probably something for testing since it's still Experimental.

Cool rifles!

[WolftalonID]

The 505 is no longer experimental. It is certified and they started deliveries two months ago. Our 505 is due delivery in August!

 

That photo was a test heli doing test flights and yes that was equipment being used dueing the test flight programs.

[adam32]

When was FAA certification completed?

[AS350 pilot]

Bell is building a new helicopter in 2017 that has the same basic rotor system on it as the Bell 47 that was the first civilian certified helicopter in March of 1946. Quick math; that's 71 years later. I actually thought the 505 was a joke and would never actually be put into production…I was wrong lol.

[adam32]

I actually thought the 505 was a joke and would never actually be put into productionI was wrong lol.

I agree. I never thought they would actually produce something so lame.

[WolftalonID]

The 505's performance and flight is by far lame. It out performs a jetranger by a long ways, as the L4 tail rotor designs, and high altitude performace. Visibility is outstanding. Cant wait to be putting it to work here in Montana. You guys are just jealous.

[AS350 pilot]

Dude, this isn't a measuring contest so I won't bother telling you the aircraft that I fly, but trust me, I'm not jealous. However, my point was that it's a poor design. I would say the same about the Jet Ranger but it was designed in the 60's so I'll cut it some slack. The L4 is also a poor design and it is significantly newer.

 

Every Bell light machine is a Franken-copter of the same ship. Example; Bell 206B - became the 206L when they decided to stretch it and add some awkward rear facing seats and a larger engine plus a few other items - it then became the 407 when they decided to add 4 blades, a FADEC, and widen the rear of the narrow cabin - and now finally the 505 takes the same poor designed underslung rotor system and throws it in a cocpit that theydesided to copy an EC120 on. At the end of the day, a guy who's 6'2" doesn't really fit in the pilot seat of the 407 with a helmet on....all for $3 million?

 

If you disagree with me, that's fine, it's nothing personal. But remember, if Bell was good at designing machines there wouldn't be companies like Van Horn making millions on redesigning all of their mistakes.

[helonorth]

Dude, this isn't a measuring contest so I won't bother telling you the aircraft that I fly, but trust me, I'm not jealous.

 

 

 

Your user name is a hint, though.

[ElJay]

Dude, this isn't a measuring contest so I won't bother telling you the aircraft that I fly, but trust me, I'm not jealous. However, my point was that it's a poor design. I would say the same about the Jet Ranger but it was designed in the 60's so I'll cut it some slack. The L4 is also a poor design and it is significantly newer.

 

Every Bell light machine is a Franken-copter of the same ship. Example; Bell 206B - became the 206L when they decided to stretch it and add some awkward rear facing seats and a larger engine plus a few other items - it then became the 407 when they decided to add 4 blades, a FADEC, and widen the rear of the narrow cabin - and now finally the 505 takes the same poor designed underslung rotor system and throws it in a cocpit that theydesided to copy an EC120 on. At the end of the day, a guy who's 6'2" doesn't really fit in the pilot seat of the 407 with a helmet on....all for $3 million?

 

If you disagree with me, that's fine, it's nothing personal. But remember, if Bell was good at designing machines there wouldn't be companies like Van Horn making millions on redesigning all of their mistakes.

Would love to hear your qualms with the 429.

[AS350 pilot]

I've never flow the 429, but have heard by all accounts that it's awesome! I don't fly ems but if I did, I would be happy to fly it. Would be good for that ship if they got the added internal gross weight thing worked out.

[adam32]

Would love to hear your qualms with the 429.

Too expensive to purchase, too expensive to maintain and too few of them flying.

[AS350 pilot]

Oh and lol, the user name would be a good hint . The AS350 is my personal favorite machine to fly but I only get to fly it about 20% of the time.

[Nearly Retired]

Wolfie says:

It out performs a jetranger by a long ways...

 

 

 

Oh, please. Of course the 505 outperforms a 206B - the French engine has got over 500 horsepower and the airframe has the L-model rotor system. It had better outperform a 206B! Remember, over the years and different models, the 206B never did get an increase to the input shp that it could take. Although the RR 250-C20B engine could put out 420 hp, the trans was still only limited to 317 hp in. So they stuck the L-model trans on the 505 and now the ship can take 495 hp for takeoff (373 max continuous).

 

The trouble is, you can't convert all that extra horsepower into cruise speed. You can only push a two-blade, underslung rotor so fast before the ride quality gets really bad. Every pilot report I've read of the 505 puts the realistic cruise speed at around 110-115 knots, which is (low-skid, non-float equipped) L-model territory, which figures.

 

Plus, with those big bubble windscreens, you sure don't want to be hooking along at 135 knots down low. A friend of mine flies a 407 up in the NY area, and he says he goes everywhere as fast as that thing will fly. Usually at 500 feet. Good weather and bad, night or day. And I'm, like, "Bubba, if *you're* not afraid of taking a bird through your windscreen, I'm afraid for you!"

 

And yeah, the 505 has a longer tailboom than a 206B, but it still has that same goddam big tail fin that blocks off so much inflow to the tail rotor. So the 505 will be *more* susceptible to weathervaning when hovering with a tailwind. And don't tell me the 206L doesn't have LTE issues; I'll show you a video that proves otherwise.

 

Nevertheless, every morning I run to my computer, connect my dial-up modem, boot-up AOL ("You've got mail!") and check the internets and chat rooms for word of the FAA certification of the 505. Every morning I am disappointed. There are obviously some unresolved issues that the Canadians didn't think were too big a deal, eh? I think I know what might be troubling the FAA, but I'll hold off on saying anything for now. Or maybe not.

 

Here's a hint: If any of you have ever flown an L-model and in training done practice engine failures from cruise, you know how...well...interesting these can be - and we don't even do them at VNE. The 505 has the same rotor system as the L-model, and its VNE is even higher! For interesting bathroom reading, check out FAR 27.143(f)(1).

[helonorth]

Oh and lol, the user name would be a good hint . The AS350 is my personal favorite machine to fly but I only get to fly it about 20% of the time.

 

Hopefully some day you will not have to fly the R-22 so much.

[AS350 pilot]

Haha well played helonorth . Nothing against the R22 but fortunately that's not the case.

[chris pochari]

I've never flow the 429, but have heard by all accounts that it's awesome! I don't fly ems but if I did, I would be happy to fly it. Would be good for that ship if they got the added internal gross weight thing worked out.

Air Zermatt CEO said that it's the best helicopter he's ever flown, better than the AS350!

[ElJay]

Air Zermatt CEO said that it's the best helicopter he's ever flown, better than the AS350!

It's strange I've never seen any mention of 429s on this forum.

[chris pochari]

It's strange I've never seen any mention of 429s on this forum.

Um OK look a little harder

[WolftalonID]

It's strange I've never seen any mention of 429s on this forum.

I have never posted a pic of me with our 429 like this...haha...

 

Oh wait maybe I did.

[ElJay]

You fly for a corporate operation?

[WolftalonID]

I fly for Rocky Mountain Rotors in Montana. VIP on demand charter/135/cinematography/photo/tours. I am also their Chief Flight Instructor for the school side of the company. We also have a small utility side that is quickly expanding.

 

We also are a factory service center for Robinsons and a Customer service center for Bell covering the 429, 407, 206, and 505.

 

A days flying can be pretty fun around here. Never know what you might be doing, or with who!

[chris pochari]

I fly for Rocky Mountain Rotors in Montana. VIP on demand charter/135/cinematography/photo/tours. I am also their Chief Flight Instructor for the school side of the company. We also have a small utility side that is quickly expanding.

 

We also are a factory service center for Robinsons and a Customer service center for Bell covering the 429, 407, 206, and 505.

 

A days flying can be pretty fun around here. Never know what you might be doing, or with who!

Is that Mark Duffy's company, I heard he was involved in a lancair 4P crash. Is he ok?

[WolftalonID]

Duffy runs Central Helicopters. Sorry to hear he was in a crash. I have not even met the crew there due to observation of conflict of interest between the two companies. Hope he is ok.

 

Duffy runs mostly KMAX helis and I think a 212?

Edited May 23, 2017 by WolftalonID