brushfire21 Posted August 14, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2007 I am afraid to that I might "open mouth and insert foot" by saying anything, but something has to happen, or business' are going to close down or come to a screeching halt if they already aren't. The whole thing is absurd, but I really like the sentance that related this silly problem to an 8th grade level, which probably isn't to far from the truth! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted August 14, 2007 Report Share Posted August 14, 2007 Thanks Brushfire,We came to the conclusion that the FAA was content to hold us out there in limbo as long as we were not flying. We could not even get them to talk to us in reference to the Alouettes. So we decided to go ahead and fly our aircraft. They still have their Standard Catagory. At least if the FAA tries an emergency suspension they'll have to do it with all the Allouettes that are supposed to be "in question". We have an Attorney that used to be an FAA attorney. He told us that they had 6 months to respond to us and at 5 months 29 days they would come up with another question and add another 6 months. We cannot stand that. So we decided to gouge a little and see what happens. At least if they try something else we may be able to at least request a hearing before a judge. One of the DAR's that has been suspended over this matter sent us a letter he received from the French DGAC stating that the FAA had asked the French to not send us our Export C of A's. Come to find out, all the Alouettes had them at one time when they were shipped from the factory. It seems that the ones that went to the military did not need them and they were not made a part of the aircraft record. The DAR had already sent the requested payment for the documents to the French. The French DGAC returned his money and informed him that the FAA had requested them not to cooperate. Go figure. They ask for a piece of paper and when we find it they block it from coming to us. We continue the battle.bossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captkirkyota Posted August 14, 2007 Report Share Posted August 14, 2007 We have an Attorney that used to be an FAA attorney. He told us that they had 6 months to respond to us and at 5 months 29 days they would come up with another question and add another 6 months. One of the DAR's that has been suspended over this matter sent us a letter he received from the French DGAC stating that the FAA had asked the French to not send us our Export C of A's. The French DGAC returned his money and informed him that the FAA had requested them not to cooperate. Go figure. They ask for a piece of paper and when we find it they block it from coming to us. We continue the battle.bossman These statements right here are INFURIATING AS HELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! someone at the FAA has a god complex and needs to have his face relocated to the furthest position to the rear of the inside of his skull! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arotrhd Posted August 15, 2007 Report Share Posted August 15, 2007 ...or inside one's posterior. Also, remember not to be sexist...their are A LOT of women, uh, I mean Females, uh, LADIES, I meant. Yeah, that's what I mean. Heck, one's in charge... Shall be nice to get the invitation to the BOSSMAN's vindication party. SOOON! -WATCH FOR THE WIRES- Came across these - nice ship & I wasn't aware that any civies had the biforcated exhausts. Come to think about it, this is where 2 faces can go at once. This one's up at the Zaca fire, supposedly flying on contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500E Posted August 15, 2007 Report Share Posted August 15, 2007 bossmanThe letter from the DAR\DGAC must be the key to it all, (worth an Alouettes weight in gold and some)Surely it shows intent on the FAAs part to cover up the mistakes they have made, the reason being it leaves them liable for your losses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voluptuary5 Posted August 15, 2007 Report Share Posted August 15, 2007 That's a VERY good point 500! A cover-up that results in economic losses. It'll be a fight, but you'll get your money back (and damages to boot). Good luck Bossman, -V5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted August 16, 2007 Report Share Posted August 16, 2007 That's a VERY good point 500! A cover-up that results in economic losses. It'll be a fight, but you'll get your money back (and damages to boot). Good luck Bossman, -V5If we can weather the storm and keep our heads above water. bossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voluptuary5 Posted August 16, 2007 Report Share Posted August 16, 2007 If we can weather the storm and keep our heads above water. bossman Yep, that's the catch. The Government has a lot more resources at their disposal than you do (and an unlimited budget apparantly). I sure hope you can weather the storm! It might be time to start thinking outside of the box... Good luck, -V5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500E Posted August 16, 2007 Report Share Posted August 16, 2007 bossman Hope your representative feels as P****d of as you do with the replys he is getting and goes after them.The idea of News\ Radio cover is a last resort I personally think, as there is no where for them to back down without loosing public face, but as they say "needs must if the devil drives" or something like that.Hope you can drum up enough support with other like affected owners to make them see sense especially as you have the letter suggesting they are asking a foreign government department to withhold documents that pertain to the problem you and others are in.Best of luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copterpilot213 Posted August 19, 2007 Report Share Posted August 19, 2007 This is some of the most messed up stuff I've heard about in awhile! To Bossman and all others affected by this, I hope a fix is found as quick as possible! They shouldn't be able to decide who to help and who not to help... If this was a helicopter that was the basis for our oil companies in the GOM to continue supplying oil to the U.S. you can be sure the FAA would have found a way to fix it. The FAA should be held to the old saying: "It's your mess, you clean it up!" Have you pursued the avenue of contacting the press about this? Or do you feel it would do more harm than good at this point? -Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 It is a screwed up deal. As of 8/9/07 we informed the FAA that we would no longer be complying with their 44709 inspection. We have put the Alouettes back in service. They will have to do an emergency revocation of the Normal Category Certificates if they do not want us to fly. If they do that, it will have to include ALL Alouettes, not just us. Loomis said he could not understand why the other owners were ignoring the re-inspection letters. We told them not to submit to the inspection. It is a real simple fix. All they have to do is request the documents from the French DGAC. If the FAA requests the paper the French will release them. We already know that the sought after paper was issued, it just did not remain with the aircraft down through the years. Oh well, I guess that would be too simple for our customer friendly FAA to consider.bossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500E Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 Hope all progresses well Bossman, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clay Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 what is the latest on the situation with the allouette's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apiaguy Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 I read on avweb last week that marpat "put the aircraft into service" and the FAA immediately revoked their airworthiness certificates..... only theirs, not other alouettes'. Hope this is how bossman is going to get something done..... I don't know.?.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copterpilot213 Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 August 27th from http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/940-full.html I hope things work out for MARPAT and others affected by this. "A West Virginia company says it wants its "day in court" to fight a seemingly perplexing decision by the FAA to ground dozens of French-built helicopters, some of which have been operating in the U.S. for years. As AVweb reported last month, the agency sent owners of some Alouette helicopters telling them they must have a "certificate of airworthiness for export" to fly legally in the U.S., even though FAA inspectors had authorized the importation of some Alouettes and issued valid U.S. C of A documents without that document. The issue mainly affects aircraft built for use by the French and German military, which have gone on the surplus market. Marpat spokesman Joe Altizer told AVweb the latest wrinkle is that while the documentation the FAA says it requires exists in French archives, French authorities are claiming the FAA has asked them not to release those documents to the owners. FAA spokesman Roland Herwig says he's looking into the allegations that the FAA is trying to block access to the French documents. Altizer said the FAA's inability or unwillingness to resolve the issue at the administrative level led him to openly defy the agency 10 days ago and that brought an immediate response in the form of an emergency revocation of the aircraft's certificate of airworthiness. Marpat's Alouette was grounded for the paperwork discrepency on July 6 and Altizer said he spent five weeks trying to get answers from the FAA about how to make it legal again. On Aug. 13 the company sent an email telling the FAA's Rotorcraft Directorate that it planned to resume flying its Alouette. After five weeks of silence, the agency responded the following day with the emergency revocation. Marpat appealed the revocation and that means a hearing must be held. Altizer said there is no safety of flight issue, as the Alouettes have shown themselves to be reliable aircraft. He said he hopes the hearing will require the FAA to reveal why it's gone to such extreme measures to ground aircraft that don't appear to be a threat to anyone." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500E Posted September 6, 2007 Report Share Posted September 6, 2007 Bossman any news? hope things are moving forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 Bossman any news? hope things are moving forward.We get our day in court on 9/11/07 in Arlington Texas. If anyone is around there on 9/11 come listen to the proceedings. It should be interesting. This is what we pushed for. It is going to be a make or break hearing for all Alouette owners and operators. If they can make this stick on this machine the orhers do not have a chance. This one was done by the FAA in Salt Lake City in 2001. The only thing they found in the 44709 conformity inspection was it did not have an export Certificate of Airworthiness. All parts were good to go, all life limited components were good to go, found no unauthorized parts, just a piece of paper that the French tell us they have and will send to us (for $3000.00) but the FAA has asked them not to give us the documents. How can they require us to have a document and when we find it, they tell the French not to let us have it? This is what the hearing, hopefully, will bring out. We'll see.bossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optigirl Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 I have learned alot in this thread. I had allways wanted to buy a UH-1, But with how the FAA operates, I am having second thoughts about working so close with them. So if the Alouettes cant get certed, What happens next to the helicopters ?do they impound them ?paperweights ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500E Posted September 7, 2007 Report Share Posted September 7, 2007 9\11 Ominous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted September 8, 2007 Report Share Posted September 8, 2007 I have learned alot in this thread. I had allways wanted to buy a UH-1, But with how the FAA operates, I am having second thoughts about working so close with them. So if the Alouettes cant get certed, What happens next to the helicopters ?do they impound them ?paperweights ?They will have to go into experimental category. You can't make money with them in experimental, all you can do is fly them around to airshows and flyins. This not only applies to the 3130 it includes all the Alouette line including Llama, 313, 318, 319, etc.Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted September 8, 2007 Report Share Posted September 8, 2007 9\11 OminousYea, don't that just beat all?Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
500E Posted September 8, 2007 Report Share Posted September 8, 2007 Hope you can hold out to the date set Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majmun Posted September 9, 2007 Report Share Posted September 9, 2007 The complete lack of integrity with regards to how the FAA is handing this case makes me sick. Best of luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copterpilot213 Posted September 9, 2007 Report Share Posted September 9, 2007 We're pulling for you bossman! When you win just tell us where the celebratory party is at! I wish I wasn't a starving student but IMO we should start a "Save the Alouttes" fund! I'm sure every little bit would help... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bossman Posted September 10, 2007 Report Share Posted September 10, 2007 We're pulling for you bossman! When you win just tell us where the celebratory party is at! I wish I wasn't a starving student but IMO we should start a "Save the Alouttes" fund! I'm sure every little bit would help...cp213,Thanks for the thoughts. Tomorrow will tell the tale. Joe is going to Arlington Texas to state our case to the judge. If the NTSB law judge goes against us we can still appeal to a jury. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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