WOFT Applicant

[zVo]

Hi everyone,

I'm an applicant for the U.S. Army warrant officer fight training program. I had my battalion board interview this past Friday and was recommended, so my packet was scanned in at BN and submitted to Fort Knox for this month's aviator selections.

 

Here are my stats --

 

20-year old male, non-prior service

42 college credits, 3.4 GPA

89 ASVAB

119 GT

127 AFAST

294 AFPT

PRK eye surgery (waivered)

105 hours flight experience, PPL (fixed-wing w/ rotary-wing experience)

6 Letters of Recommendation

[incl. an Air Force Brig. Gen and Army CW4 & CW3 aviators]

 

It's been a long road with the packet process. I applied last year and got all the way through the BN interview - only to have my packet rejected because my flight physical was kicked back from Fort Rucker Aeromedical (cycloplegic refraction was off from the Army's standards & had to get PRK done).

 

I'm awaiting feedback on the results; supposedly the April selection board results have still not been posted, so if it is any indication as to when I'll find out, it may not be until the beginning of June.

 

I realize I don't have the best stats (highest AFAST & GT score, GPA, etc.), but I really question how much weight they carry in the big picture. Obviously college, AFAST, etc. are all ways of narrowing down candidates, but to me it seems like it's all about the character references of the candidate. I was talking to a woman who was at my WOFT board who got rejected six months ago, and she had a 147 AFAST, 3.8 GPA -- something I would think would be a definite selection. She also mentioned she had only 3 LORs, and by the sound of it, they weren't reputable letters. In the meantime, she said a high school graduate with a 3pt.-something GPA and some flight experience (I don't know if he/she had a certificate) got selected over her. I'm going off on a bit of a tangent, but with all that said, I think that indicates that there is more to the selection process than just "good stats;" I have a feeling LORs carry the most weight.

 

Anyway, I thought I'd share some resources I've come across over the past year that may help or encourage some of you who are interested in applying.

 

- FY2011 Budget Includes Funding For New Pilots, Flight Crews

- Army WOFT Selection Rate Going From 60% In-Army, 40% Civilian Selection to 50/50

 

And here's an article explaining the state of flight training @ Rucker, which *MAY* negatively affect selection rates for FY2010 (including my board).

- Ft. Rucker Flight Training "Bubble" Due To IP Shortages

 

Finally, attached is a PowerPoint that is intended for civilian and prior-service applicants looking to apply to WOFT; it's fairly thorough in explaining everything that is needed for a 100%, BN-ready packet.

 

EDIT: I guess the forum attachments don't work! Sorry.

 

Anyway, good luck to all of you that have applied, are applying, or are thinking about applying... and hopefully I get picked up within the next two selection boards!

Edited May 25, 2010 by zVo

[Lindsey]

Let us know when you find out when the USAREC selection dates is for you. I already told you this, but congrats on being done! Sit back, relax, and go have fun flying in @#$%ing gorgeous Colorado.

[IjustWant2fly]

Between your flying experience, 6 LOR's, and excellent APFT, I think you should definitely be more confident about yourself. Good luck!

[zVo]

Thanks for the encouragement, Lindsey and IjustWant2fly.

 

Supposedly the civilian warrant officer selections for May take place this Friday, but being that its Memorial Day Weekend, I'm guessing that will affect the turnaround time before the results are posted. Memorial Day aside, how long does it typically take before the selections are posted and the recruiters are notified?

 

I'm beyond anxious.

[Lindsey]

I'm beyond anxious.

 

I'm beyond jealous.

[zVo]

I'm beyond jealous.

 

Don't be too jealous -- you'll have better odds applying in FY2011. Over the past few years, USAREC has been recruiting 300 street-to-seat pilots each FY, or 25 selects per month. Due to the backlog at Rucker, they pretty much halfed it so selection rates are averaging out approximately 12 civilian selectees each month.

 

In other news, I just talked to someone else whose applying for the May '10 board and I guess they moved the selection date to tomorrow due to the sheer amount of applicants they received this month. It's going to be super competitive, but I'm keeping the faith that I've got a solid shot.

[NorCalHeliKid]

It really is ALL in the LORS, fortunately or not, depending on your situation and ability to apply nepotism. There was an 18 year old kid in my WOCS class, he just so happen to have a CW 4 for a father and two CW 3 brothers...Army Aviation is a small small world.

 

 

Don't be too jealous -- you'll have better odds applying in FY2011. Over the past few years, USAREC has been recruiting 300 street-to-seat pilots each FY, or 25 selects per month. Due to the backlog at Rucker, they pretty much halfed it so selection rates are averaging out approximately 12 civilian selectees each month.

 

In other news, I just talked to someone else whose applying for the May '10 board and I guess they moved the selection date to tomorrow due to the sheer amount of applicants they received this month. It's going to be super competitive, but I'm keeping the faith that I've got a solid shot.

[akscott60]

Good luck man. I remember the wait. It suuuucked. But it passed. Now I am 8 days from starting my journey.

[zVo]

I received the news today that I was not selected for the May '10 board. My packet will get a second look in June, but given how competitive it is right now, I'm not holding my breath.

 

Just as clarification, if I am not picked up in June, how long must I wait before I can resubmit a packet? I've heard six months commonly referenced, but I've also heard that it is possible to resubmit your packet (or get reinterviewed at the BN level) for the next month under certain circumstances.

 

Can anyone explain the difference between FQ-NS and NC-NS and how that plays into the resubmission period?

 

akscott60, oh how I wish I could be in your shoes right now! Good luck at BCT, WOCS, DUNKER, & SERE! Flight school seems like it'll be the easy part, haha! You'll have to keep us all posted with how your training is coming along. Good luck! June 1st is practically here.

 

NorCalHeliKid, you make a great point for LORs. How does an 18-year old kid beat out a CFI? It has to the letters, no doubt. Even despite my letters, I didn't get selected. Hopefully June yields some better results.

Edited May 27, 2010 by zVo

[Stephen85]

I received the news today that I was not selected for the May '10 board. My packet will get a second look in June, but given how competitive it is right now, I'm not holding my breath.

 

Just as clarification, if I am not picked up in June, how long must I wait before I can resubmit a packet? I've heard six months commonly referenced, but I've also heard that it is possible to resubmit your packet (or get reinterviewed at the BN level) for the next month under certain circumstances.

 

Can anyone explain the difference between FQ-NS and NC-NS and how that plays into the resubmission period?

 

akscott60, oh how I wish I could be in your shoes right now! Good luck at BCT, WOCS, DUNKER, & SERE! Flight school seems like it'll be the easy part, haha! You'll have to keep us all posted with how your training is coming along. Good luck! June 1st is practically here.

 

NorCalHeliKid, you make a great point for LORs. How does an 18-year old kid beat out a CFI? It has to the letters, no doubt. Even despite my letters, I didn't get selected. Hopefully June yields some better results.

 

 

That's unfortunate, especially given your credentials. Although from my research it sounds like a lot of people are boarded the second go around more often then their first look. Good luck to you - you'll eventually get it, even if not this next board.

[panzer1999]

FQ-NS means that you are Fully Qualified but not selected for whatever reason. NC-NS is non-competitive not selected. So if you are FQ-NS then have hope for next month. If you are NC-NS then plan on doing some things to beef up your packet for down the road. What did you get?

[Lindsey]

This makes me very, very nervous. Like I wasn't enough already...

 

You had the high-ranking letters. You had the stellar APFT. You had the flight time. You have some college, and with a good GPA. I just don't get it!

 

My letters are good, but not elite. My APFT sucks at the moment, to improve vastly by the time I apply (But still! You have a 294-not much room for improvement, there!). I don't have the flight time. I have 3.8 hours RW, 1.4 FW. Nothing when compared to the thousand-hour CFIs who are applying. My GPA sucks, honestly. I'm trying very hard not to get discouraged, but this is just ridiculous, zVo. Your packet was stellar (or at least I thought so). I know that no one aside from those actually on the USAREC board knows exactly what they look for and how they make their decisions, but it just seems like you can do everything right, like zVo, but be missing out on just one area (college degree) and be left out on the street.

 

This is just my confused-and-been-up-for-48-hours rambling, and its not really going anywhere. Sorry this isn't very constructive to the conversation. I just thought I should speak up for Zack here, because I've been talking to him and his enthusiasm for WOFT could not have been more apparent.

 

This just simply boggles the mind.

 

/rant

[IWannaFly]

Keep in mind that the needs of the Army changes. They might not need as many aviators or for some reason they may have just skimmed the packet or any number of things. My point is that you shouldn't get discouraged. I had the same issue my first board FQ-NS. I was picked up for the second though. Just relax. If you don't get selected on the second board, wait the required amount of time and then resubmit it. Lots of people do that.

 

Blake

[akscott60]

I have been there. First board NS. Even with my stellar letters of reco, being a CFII, etc etc.

 

Take a deep breath. Wait 3 weeks. See what happens.

[Amhuinn]

"Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence.

Talent will not; nothing in the world is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.

Genius will not; unrewarded genius is a proverb.

Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts.

Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent."

 

~ Calvin Coolidge

[SBuzzkill]

Indeed they are, and if you pair them with education, talent, and genius you will be unstoppable.

 

To all those who are getting discouraged, hang in there! Every board is different and it's just a matter of getting the one you fit in to. There are Army Aviators of all types and backgrounds here; They are not looking for a single type of person.

 

Put together the most professional packet you can, keep your head up, and apply apply apply!

[zVo]

I never followed up with my previous post and I thought I'd follow up with where I am.

 

I was considered a NC-NS in the May 2010 board, so my packet did not even receive a second look in the following month. I still can't believe I was not at the very last considered a a FQ-NS. Other than not having a bachelors degree finished, I cannot imagine what else made me non-competitive. Anyway, as of next month I will be eligible to apply again and I intend on doing so.

 

According to my recruiter (back in April), he stated that if I failed to be selected for WOFT, my flight physical would become invalid. Is there any truth to this? It sounded like a ploy to get me to enlist if all else fails, but I haven't found anything officially that says one way or the other. A Class 1A physical is valid for 18 months, so it should be good for at least another year, correct? I do not possess the flight physical myself, but would a recruiter be able to pull the record from Ft. Carson (or Ft. Rucker)?

[akscott60]

Wait, you were NC-NS? Really? What gives? Well, your phys is good for 18 months, and try applying again.

[USAR153D]

Hi everyone,

I'm an applicant for the U.S. Army warrant officer fight training program. I had my battalion board interview this past Friday and was recommended, so my packet was scanned in at BN and submitted to Fort Knox for this month's aviator selections.

 

Here are my stats --

 

20-year old male, non-prior service

42 college credits, 3.4 GPA

89 ASVAB

119 GT

127 AFAST

294 AFPT

PRK eye surgery (waivered)

105 hours flight experience, PPL (fixed-wing w/ rotary-wing experience)

6 Letters of Recommendation

[incl. an Air Force Brig. Gen and Army CW4 & CW3 aviators]

 

It's been a long road with the packet process. I applied last year and got all the way through the BN interview - only to have my packet rejected because my flight physical was kicked back from Fort Rucker Aeromedical (cycloplegic refraction was off from the Army's standards & had to get PRK done).

 

I'm awaiting feedback on the results; supposedly the April selection board results have still not been posted, so if it is any indication as to when I'll find out, it may not be until the beginning of June.

 

I realize I don't have the best stats (highest AFAST & GT score, GPA, etc.), but I really question how much weight they carry in the big picture. Obviously college, AFAST, etc. are all ways of narrowing down candidates, but to me it seems like it's all about the character references of the candidate. I was talking to a woman who was at my WOFT board who got rejected six months ago, and she had a 147 AFAST, 3.8 GPA -- something I would think would be a definite selection. She also mentioned she had only 3 LORs, and by the sound of it, they weren't reputable letters. In the meantime, she said a high school graduate with a 3pt.-something GPA and some flight experience (I don't know if he/she had a certificate) got selected over her. I'm going off on a bit of a tangent, but with all that said, I think that indicates that there is more to the selection process than just "good stats;" I have a feeling LORs carry the most weight.

 

Anyway, I thought I'd share some resources I've come across over the past year that may help or encourage some of you who are interested in applying.

 

- FY2011 Budget Includes Funding For New Pilots, Flight Crews

- Army WOFT Selection Rate Going From 60% In-Army, 40% Civilian Selection to 50/50

 

And here's an article explaining the state of flight training @ Rucker, which *MAY* negatively affect selection rates for FY2010 (including my board).

- Ft. Rucker Flight Training "Bubble" Due To IP Shortages

 

Finally, attached is a PowerPoint that is intended for civilian and prior-service applicants looking to apply to WOFT; it's fairly thorough in explaining everything that is needed for a 100%, BN-ready packet.

 

EDIT: I guess the forum attachments don't work! Sorry.

 

Anyway, good luck to all of you that have applied, are applying, or are thinking about applying... and hopefully I get picked up within the next two selection boards!

"The FY 2011 request sustains the FY 2010 increase and seeks an additional $65 million to train 1,500 new pilots per year by FY 2012."

 

Now that's motivating!

 

BTW congrats on getting everything in!

[zVo]

By no means do I believe I have the perfect application, but I was very surprised that my package was considered non-competitive. I was told by my recruiter that the civilian applicants selected that month all had bachelors degrees, so perhaps I needed more college completed.

 

Thanks for the encouragement everyone! akscott60, good to know! I'm beginning to piece together my packet again, so I'm aiming for the December board if at all possible.

 

Anyone have any idea of what the "stats" are of some of the civilian applicants getting picked up are lately?

[akscott60]

based on what I know of my WOCS class I would say 30% had flight experience, 60% were college grads. Some had none of either.

[Lindsey]

By no means do I believe I have the perfect application, but I was very surprised that my package was considered non-competitive. I was told by my recruiter that the civilian applicants selected that month all had bachelors degrees, so perhaps I needed more college completed.

 

Thanks for the encouragement everyone! akscott60, good to know! I'm beginning to piece together my packet again, so I'm aiming for the December board if at all possible.

 

Anyone have any idea of what the "stats" are of some of the civilian applicants getting picked up are lately?

 

Honestly, I'm wondering if perhaps your paperwork got messed up. Something wasn't filled out properly, or something didn't get sent in. It's the only way I can figure you'd get an NC-NS with the packet you had.