cburg Posted May 11, 2014 Report Share Posted May 11, 2014 If y'all get to fly a tiltrotor, you'll be hooked, because you get get to fly low and fast, and then hover! As a mil guy doing research in preparation to get out, it seems that helo salaries start a little better but top out sooner. It appears that the starting salaries for most of your typical offshore or EMS gigs are way better than airlines for the first several years, but if that fixed-wing guy advances (and doesn't get laid off) he can earn six figures, and while the helo pilot probably isn't.Tilt rotors (power lift) will be going offshore...of that there is no doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palmfish Posted May 11, 2014 Report Share Posted May 11, 2014 Generalizations abound here. There are many paths that a person can follow down an aviation career - fixed and rotary. There are many fixed-wing pilots who will never see 6-figures and many rotary-pilots who will. Yes, the odds may be stacked somewhat in favor of fixed-wing salary-wise, but it isnt a guarantee and it isnt just about money. If it was, then we would all be plastic surgeons. FWIW, in the anecdote I provided above about the JetBlue pilots, I believe their stories are pretty typical of fixed-wing career realities, and I wouldnt trade seats with them if I could. I have no desire to fly a bus and my job security, retirement benefits, salary, and health insurance is better than theirs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airhead Posted May 11, 2014 Report Share Posted May 11, 2014 One of the reasons I went into helicopters was the student to real job time-frame appeared to be faster. I think this still holds true if you are very lucky, smart, and a hard worker. It is possible to get your hours and get into a single pilot turbine rather quickly. However, I have seen a lot of people fail in the process and sometimes wonder how things would have turned out for them if they went fixed wing. I perceive it to be easier to learn and there are way more CFI jobs out there for fixed wing so the general odds of making it are better. It is also very important to me to hand fly a maneuverable aircraft with the the stick coming up from the floor. Not with a yoke or a computer. This is probably because I was addicted to fighter jets and warbirds as a kid :-) I am still stuck with the T-bar right now but the dream will never die. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 Generalizations abound here. There are many paths that a person can follow down an aviation career - fixed and rotary. There are many fixed-wing pilots who will never see 6-figures and many rotary-pilots who will. Yes, the odds may be stacked somewhat in favor of fixed-wing salary-wise, but it isnt a guarantee and it isnt just about money. If it was, then we would all be plastic surgeons. FWIW, in the anecdote I provided above about the JetBlue pilots, I believe their stories are pretty typical of fixed-wing career realities, and I wouldnt trade seats with them if I could. I have no desire to fly a bus and my job security, retirement benefits, salary, and health insurance is better than theirs.Not much (but some) talk about the Union's seniority. Unless you are very young...pay-for-perfomance is a better deal probably. I get a kick out of the saying "American Eagle...the land of the 10-year upgrade." That's to go from the right seat to the left to log your first PIC/Turbine hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pokey Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 tilt rotors have no future, its a novelty that can't do what a helicopter can do, nor a fixed wing. What is another 80 or so mph on a short trip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 tilt rotors have no future, its a novelty that can't do what a helicopter can do, nor a fixed wing. What is another 80 or so mph on a short trip? Range and speed will be increasing necessary the further out we drill. Our flight dept is already looking at them. Chevron has flown them offshore. I think it's not if...but when...and how many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avbug Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 Not much (but some) talk about the Union's seniority. Unless you are very young...pay-for-perfomance is a better deal probably. I get a kick out of the saying "American Eagle...the land of the 10-year upgrade." That's to go from the right seat to the left to log your first PIC/Turbine hour. "Pay for performance?" You haven't flown for an airline, have you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ospreydriver Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 tilt rotors have no future, its a novelty that can't do what a helicopter can do, nor a fixed wing. What is another 80 or so mph on a short trip? More like 100-150 more knots. It won't help much on a short trip, but if a couple of tilt rotors or other high-speed vertical lift can replace an area covered by multiple bases with conventional helos, you can bet a company will do it if the numbers work out. But I digress. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 "Pay for performance?" You haven't flown for an airline, have you? Perhaps I was not clear...I agree with you. The union model is the opposite of the PFP model, which is better for a late starter. Which precludes a late start in the regionals...and yes I speak from experience...I have the check stubs (and the rating acquisition costs) to prove it regrettably. PFP would be “almost” anything other than the airlines....or auto assembly line. I suppose it’s possible to fly in China and break through, but after living and working there for 7 years I would not advocate that either. (NOTE: I'm trying not to slam unions since I was a member of the Teamsters, Boilermakers, and Pipefitters unions in my former lives) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam32 Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 Plank pliots can also get into dropping skydivers...3-5 turns in hour up to 12,000ft could be pretty darn fun.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avbug Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 So...what is "pay for performance," and where is it found in aviation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pohi Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 Everything you need to know can be found here: https://www.google.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 So...what is "pay for performance," and where is it found in aviation?It's any job/company/industry where compensation is based on education, skill, merit, productivity, if the boss likes you, etc,...anything other than *strictly* seniority...like the airlines....in which it's best to be young with rich generous parents who can subsidize you though your first 5 years of shear poverty (it's amazing how many regional FO's manage to drive BMWs on $19,000 a year). Lincoln and Nucor are famous examples: http://debwagner.info/hpttoolkit/pfp_hpt.htm http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/company/careers/pages/lincoln-tradition.aspx http://www.nucor.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying Pig Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 Plank pilots can also get into dropping skydivers...3-5 turns in hour up to 12,000ft could be pretty darn fun. Believe me.... the fun wears off pretty quick. You arent going to really make a living at it unless you get into a big school. I flew a 182 and a 206 for $50 a day and would sometimes fly 8-10hrs a day and the only time you get out is for gas and when you REALLY have to pee. And thats usually when you are getting gas. If you are to the point where you can fly a King Air or a 208 you could start making a little money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aeroscout Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 Believe me.... the fun wears off pretty quick. You arent going to really make a living at it unless you get into a big school. I flew a 182 and a 206 for $50 a day and would sometimes fly 8-10hrs a day and the only time you get out is for gas and when you REALLY have to pee. And thats usually when you are getting gas. If you are to the point where you can fly a King Air or a 208 you could start making a little money. I can second everything Flying Pig has offered. When you run the numbers for a helicopter drop aircraft it's even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam32 Posted May 13, 2014 Report Share Posted May 13, 2014 Believe me.... the fun wears off pretty quick. You arent going to really make a living at it unless you get into a big school. I flew a 182 and a 206 for $50 a day and would sometimes fly 8-10hrs a day and the only time you get out is for gas and when you REALLY have to pee. And thats usually when you are getting gas. If you are to the point where you can fly a King Air or a 208 you could start making a little money. No different then being a heli CFI, but the heli CFI will be flying a lot less and making less money with the same long hours. 8-10 hours a day will build your time up real fast to move on to more money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cburg Posted May 14, 2014 Report Share Posted May 14, 2014 More like 100-150 more knots. It won't help much on a short trip, but if a couple of tilt rotors or other high-speed vertical lift can replace an area covered by multiple bases with conventional helos, you can bet a company will do it if the numbers work out. But I digress.Aviatrex posted elsewhere: "Rotorbound, I live up the road from you in Apex. Are you by any chance affiliated with MCAS New River? A chopper buddy got me a hour of time in the Osprey full-motion simulator down there. That's one interesting beast to fly. All I can say is it doesn't fly like a helicopter." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ospreydriver Posted June 8, 2014 Report Share Posted June 8, 2014 It mostly flies like an airplane, because 90% of the time that's what it it. I am at MCAS New River. I'll be here for about another year, then I've go to grow up and get a real job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avbug Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 No different then being a heli CFI, but the heli CFI will be flying a lot less and making less money with the same long hours. 8-10 hours a day will build your time up real fast to move on to more money... The helicopter instructor who moves on after a thousand hours looks forward to a pay increase and turbine equipment. The fixed wing instructor does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hand_Grenade_Pilot Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 I'm just getting some perspective on everything. Everything has fell into place to start training for pilot, but I must lose 50lbs to get to 180lbs so I can train and then teach in r22. I want to lose the weight anyways just because I hate what I did to myself, BUT I have to go to a school in salt lake, or Arizona. And I have a couple fixed wing schools out here in so Cali that I can go to. Honestly I just want to fly that is all I care about so I may end up doing this route anyways I'm just wondering why you guys went heli and not fix.The choice was pretty easy for me. Not smart enough to fly for the airlines. No college degree, no desire to have one. And I thought hovering was pretty badass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avbug Posted June 9, 2014 Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 You don't need a degree to fly for the airlines. There are a few exceptions, but it's not required. "Smart" has nothing to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffs Posted June 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2014 Thanks for all the replies guys, I have been gone for awhile with school, work, and life. But I still haven't lost the dream. I will be going heli, I actually asked this question because my wife (soon to be ex) has a school she can go to in cypress CA and they had an airplane school out there that I could go too. Well stuff went down hill with her, was trying to make it work but she was dumb. Anyways I will be hopefully flying helicopters starting in 2016 after I get my first associates degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aeroscout Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 The helicopter instructor who moves on after a thousand hours looks forward to a pay increase and turbine equipment. The fixed wing instructor does not.So you assert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avbug Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 So you assert. So I do. How far did you get in your fixed wing career? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aeroscout Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 So I do. How far did you get in your fixed wing career?I hesitate to say, lest you add to your list of 2 lies about me that you have not retracted or apologized for.But of this you can be certain, much farther than you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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