king of the sky

[Chewie]

Let me tell you a true story. An FAA inspector is at a campground beach with his family. There are about 50 people on the beach, and the beach is around 3000 feet long. I know, I have camped there. An airplane flew overhead, at about 300 AGL along the waterline. The inspector wrote down the tail number and violated the pilot for flying over a congested area at less than the required 1000AGL (for an airplane).

 

Now, having read that. And having seen this video, what do you think that same inspector would think? BTW, that pilot lost his certificate, and appealed to the NTSB. My understanding is he lost that appeal.

 

You could accomplish the same things that helicopter just did, and do them in a way which meets the FAR's and doesnt cause these kinds of discussions on VR. Dropping ping pong balls over bystanders heads and flying the skids in the water would not be viewed by any inspector I know as a safe operation. Operating out of the HV curve, over workmen trained and in communications with the helicopter, with a safety briefing, with people wearing PPE, could be a perfectly safe operation within the FAR's.

 

While I am not going to criticize that pilot,(he may be bigger than me...then again..not likely!), I hope I never fly like that and then go set down and think I have just conducted the safest operation possible within the parameters I had to work with.

 

Fly safe,

 

Goldy

 

 

Wow I don't check in here for a day or so and I come back to find this thread lit up. Never though people would actually be defending that guy, whatever I guess. Yes Trans I know that's what we do, some operations more than others, it's part of the job, but is anyone actually saying that doing it for S's and G's or to impress a bunch of kids on a dock ISN'T a dumb idea?? Or an unnecessary risk to yourself, your aircraft, or the people on the water/dock in this case??

 

Goldy is right, "Operating out of the HV curve, over workmen trained and in communications with the helicopter, with a safety briefing, with people wearing PPE, could be a perfectly safe operation within the FAR's" isn't the same as some random dude flyin down to the surface of the water around people who (more likely than not) were not prepared or involved until he showed up...FARs...Undue hazard...not smart.

 

And another random FAR, was he operating under hire? Did he have flotation devices/gear on board, cause that looks like "beyond power off glide distance from shore" to me. Not saying that was the case, just another one that occurred to me.

 

If you go around busting FARs and putting uninvolved people at risk causing undue hazard, AND someone posts a vid of it AND includes the tail number, don't be surprised if the FAA come a knockin.

 

Case of really poor decision making, and everyone has an opinion and is entitled to it but calling out those people who said it was dumb with "who do you work for/what do you do?" blah blah blah is a little schoolyard don't ya think? No one that I have seen jumped on any of this guys defenders right off the bat.

 

Whatever your opinion we have to agree that what a handful of us do can effect the whole industry right? Especially with the plethora of video cams out there. A few "wrongs" can undo a whole lot of "rights" in the general public's view it seems.

[HelliBoy]

I would just like to remind everyone that none of us was there behind the stick.

 

 

I would never blow someone into the FAA without FULL knowledge of the facts and circumstances, and would never forward a vid to my POI just to kiss his a$$. You can say thats not what you were doing but thats what it looks like to me and most everyone else. So congratulations hero, just hope no one ever sees you do anything stupid, or better yet anything that they deemed from their den was stupid. Why dont you think back accross your carreer and write down the times that you 'may' have violated a reg., put it in an envolope, and mail it to your POI or whomever. That way no one will ever have to repeat YOUR mistakes. Unless a sky god like you never made any. Unbelievable.

[helonorth]

Just out of sheer curiosity, what makes this acceptable and what took place in the video non-acceptable? Does it go back to what svrider posted and the issue of consent?

Granted it still isn't very smart what he did...just wondering...

Who said that was acceptable? Can't see any reason to be that close to the water.

Edited July 21, 2010 by helonorth

[SBuzzkill]

I would just like to remind everyone that none of us was there behind the stick.

 

 

I would never blow someone into the FAA without FULL knowledge of the facts and circumstances, and would never forward a vid to my POI just to kiss his a$$. You can say thats not what you were doing but thats what it looks like to me and most everyone else. So congratulations hero, just hope no one ever sees you do anything stupid, or better yet anything that they deemed from their den was stupid. Why dont you think back accross your carreer and write down the times that you 'may' have violated a reg., put it in an envolope, and mail it to your POI or whomever. That way no one will ever have to repeat YOUR mistakes. Unless a sky god like you never made any. Unbelievable.

 

Just because a video gets forwarded to the FAA doesn't mean anything will come of it. If they do determine that it was unsafe and that it violated regulations then that pilot got what was coming to him.

 

I'm sorry if you want to live in a world where you can do what you want without consequences, but it doesn't exist. Just be glad the consequence in this case isn't the loss of those kids' lives.

Edited July 21, 2010 by SBuzzkill

[Mikemv]

Wow, this got to be a heated post/responses! I will not take sides by stating pros or cons or agreeing with anyone or not.

 

Let me state that I have had to answer to FAA Inspectors when someone(even once a drunk woman) called in my tail number during a photo flight or LE training mission or such. I answered all of their questions, was thanked for a speedy response and complimented for using good Risk Management techniques!

 

I have mentored pilots and told them that an element of flying safely is to be able to answer to an FAA Inspector or an attorney/judge in court with confidence and state "I feel my decision was the safest course of action".

 

With 80 to 85% of our accidents caused by pilot error, I have taken on a mission thru my Seminars to teach/reinforce good ADM, RA, RM and reduce pilot errors and the helcopter accident rate.

 

Helicopter flying is risky as as a course of normal operations and special mission requirements. As PICs we accept the "Sacred Trust" of the paxs to bring them back as safely as they departed.

 

If we would all fly using good ADM techniques and accepting "The Sacred Trust", it would not matter if someone called in our tail number or we were in court!

 

Safe flying to All,

 

Sincerely, Mike

[heloidaho]

Who said that was acceptable? Can't see any reason to be that close to the water.

 

Of course there was a reason. If you look really close on that video you can see that those skids are special hollow skids and this R44 was really just picking up some water to go throw on an orphanage fire.

 

All kidding aside, who cares if someone notified the FAA of the video. The damn thing is out on YouTube with the tail number and a pretty sarastic comment about the safety of the flight. It isn't like the video is on a private message board or like it was stolen off of someone's server to turn it into the FAA.

 

If that pilot doesn't want his flying scrutinized by the public, then he or she shouldn't go flying for no reason but to show off for a bunch of easily impressed high school kids with cameras.

[permison]

Ok, you guys who are calling Heliops need to stop it (That means you Clay). I don't work for Heliops, I have flown with Dennis once. You guys are completly out of line. You don't need to know who I am or who I work for. Trying to get me fired because of a post I made on a website is completely out of line.

[SBuzzkill]

Wow, that is just ridiculous. Especially when you were doing the right thing.

Edited July 21, 2010 by SBuzzkill

[clay]

are you kidding me?!?! you think im trying to get you fired? haha. I was just curious what line of work your in . simple as that. it says your in Colorado, and I called someone I know in Colorado. dont flatter yourself

[permison]

More importantly, you guys who are defending this guys actions should be ashamed of yourselves. You know full well that he was out of line and acted with extreamly poor judgement. And to have it caught on video? Good god, if I ever get caught like this the FAA better pull my ticket.

 

One has to wonder why the suggestion that the FAA should know about this would cause such a response from some people. Maybe his flying and poor judgement hits close to home. I sure hope you are not flying like this.

 

You're acting like children on the play ground. You're adults, grow up.

[RotorWeed]

Who here would fly like this in front of an FAA inspector? And explain why please. I need to be educated.

 

RW

[IFLY]

Ok I guess it's my turn.

Approach - OKish

Hovering too close to dock with people - bad.

dropping pingpong balls - completely legal.

when swimmers jumped in hovered away - good.

dipped skids - about as stupid as you can get.

was as far away from boat as from dock - not good.

departed after boat moved - best idea he had.

 

Jerry

[pendulosity]

Three little words, "careless or reckless". Last time I checked the FAA didn't have a sense of humor and I don't think they ever will. A friend of mine was caught flying his helicopter in a manner the FAA deemed "careless" and decided he needed to be punished. I can assure everyone that his little stunt was nothing compared to this. The person flying that helicopter was satisfying his ego and nothing more. He probably wears his flight suit in public to impress everyone. What a tool.

[Lindsey]

The insults that are flying around here are ridiculous. People disagree, so what? Is this Justhelicopters or is this Vertical Reference?

 

In an industry as small as rotary-wing aviation, I would hope people would conduct themselves more professionally. And no, this is not aimed at anyone in particular.

[ChprPlt]

Three little words, "careless or reckless". Last time I checked the FAA didn't have a sense of humor and I don't think they ever will. A friend of mine was caught flying his helicopter in a manner the FAA deemed "careless" and decided he needed to be punished. I can assure everyone that his little stunt was nothing compared to this. The person flying that helicopter was satisfying his ego and nothing more. He probably wears his flight suit in public to impress everyone. What a tool.

 

 

Just curious what was did the FAA do to your friend?

[permison]

It is just shocking to me that people would jump to this guys defense. I can't believe the response outside of VR that I have heard about in this guys defense.

 

If this was your aircraft or someone who flew for you would you find this acceptable? If you can say yes to this you need your head examined. Regardless of if he was legal or not it was clearly reckless. More importantly the FARs are the "MINIMUM STANDARD" not the goal. Each of us has a responsibility to fly better than the standard.

 

And the hidden "Pilot Brotherhood"? Really? This isn't some union picket line I crossed. This is an idiot flying stupid pure and simple. You guys are acting like I ratted out a member of the Crips or the Bloods. This isn't a street gang where everyone protects someone wearing the same colors or who lives on the same block. Really?? Trying to get me fired because I reported this ass. You need a serious reality check about what safe flying looks like. Wonder what your chief pilot would think about your defense of this idiot or that you called my company trying to get me fired.

 

What if that was your kid in the boat or on the dock. This guy is a private pilot. And does not meet the maturity requirements for it.

 

Defending this guy is like defending a drunk driver. And yes if I see someone I think is driving drunk you bet your ass I will report him and follow him till the cops show up, and I am proud to say I have done it before.

 

I stand by my decision to turn him in. And have nothing to explain or prove to anyone of you.

[ChprPlt]

Permison- I'm pretty sure everyone understands your position on this topic.

[PhotoFlyer]

Ladies and Gentlemen, I believe this thread has gone on long enough.