Army vs Air Force Helicopter Pilot

droz88 · March 4, 2014

As I understand it, Air Force UPT students who select Rotary Wing on selection night get sent to Ft. Rucker and attend the RW course along with Army WOFT students. Correct?

If this is correct, then how would you sum up the difference between a Army helicopter pilot vs a Air Force helicopter pilot? Other than rank, what is the difference (if any) between the proficiency, type of flying/missions, and the HH-60 vs the UH-60?

Thanks. I'd be fortunate to be offered a slot in either program but am curious about differences to expect as a helicopter pilot in either branch.

Edited March 4, 2014 by droz88

apacheguy · March 4, 2014

They're basically 'separate but equal' at Rucker. You may see the AF folks on post but you never interact with them.

As far as differences between them and us, helicopters are pretty rare in the AF, they get the ass and trash missions; in the army we are a key member of the combined arms fight.

Jon B. · March 4, 2014

For reference, in both of my Afghanistan rotations I saw AF helos ONCE in over two years worth of being in country. I wasn't stationed on some big base either.

You see Army helicopters daily. Like was said before me, they're an integral part of the "fight". My guess is if you had the choice, I would definitely fly Army.

Ardo09203 · March 4, 2014

It's easy,

Want to fly Helicopters? Go Army

Want to fly Jets? Go Navy

Want to fly the Space Shuttle? Go Airforce

Want to blow stuff up? Go Marines

Can't Swim? Go CG

Jon B. · March 4, 2014

Can't Swim? Go CG

That made me laugh out loud.

zaurus · March 4, 2014

Droz88

The AF trains totally separate from the Army since the early 2000s. That came about when the Army went to Flight School XXI. The AF has the use of the airdrome at Cairns airfield and the fort facilities, at a price of course. The AF transferred rotary wing pilot training to Ft Rucker in 1971. As of a few years ago, the AF flies the new modernized glass cockpit TH-1H.

The AF is comprised of approximately 100 helicopters in their fleet vs the Army's thousands. The AF only produces between 60 and 70 helo pilots yearly vs 1200 fixed wing pilots. Selecting a helo slot in AF SUPT is extremely competitive. Upon completion of SUPT, their aircraft options based on merit and availability are the following: HH-60 (Combat Search & Rescue), UH-1N (VIP and Missile support), CV-22A (Special Ops) and first assignment IP in the TH-1H.

If you want helos, you best select the Army and fly above the best.

d10 · March 4, 2014

I don't know about the other missions but if you fly 60s in the AF you're going to spend years waiting around for a single PR mission while acting like a douchebag and cutting in on Army Medevac missions which you won't do as well as the real Medevac.

Velocity173 · March 4, 2014

I don't know about the other missions but if you fly 60s in the AF you're going to spend years waiting around for a single PR mission while acting like a douchebag and cutting in on Army Medevac missions which you won't do as well as the real Medevac.

That's exactly what happened. I think it was around 2005 they started complaining that there was no CSAR and they wanted to get in on the MEDEVAC action. Next thing you know they're rock stars on Nat Geo.

What makes me laugh is that most CSAR can easily be done by the Army without being officially designated. By the time dedicated CSAR assets get done with the planning, some Army 60 out and about on a ring route has already picked them up and dropped them off at base. Don't get me wrong, they play an important part in the early stages of a conflict and for deep (Libya F-15E) PR but everyday kinda stuff, not so much.

Edited March 4, 2014 by Velocity173

Talon64 · March 4, 2014

I got to fly a lot with Huey pilots in support of the nuclear missions. Over 1000 hours of airborne security and it can be monotonous but I thinks it's better than flying dv's around in the Hueys. There are some liberties in which can be exercised that makes flying fun. At least sitting in the back it was fun.

droz88 · March 5, 2014

Thanks guy. This info is helping me make a decision on which path to take.

I posted this same question on an Air Force pilot forum and their gripe was that Army should pay the Warrant pilots the same as regular O's.

Would it be fair to say that a helo pilot in the army will be flying more intense and demanding missions than a helo pilot in the air force? I ask because that's the type of flying I'd like to do instead of just calm high altitude flights.

Joe_P148 · March 5, 2014

Droz I don't feel like the Airforce's rotary job is a bad gig I just don't think many pilots join the Airforce with the goal of being a H 60 pilot. The CSAR role that the Airforce's is suppose to execute is not needed but the Airforce's H 60s do have the capability of very cool stuff like aerial refuel.

Ultimately it boils down to, what do you want? You may not get a guaranteed helo slot in the AF but I can almost 100% guarantee your quality of life will be better than a Army Warrant Officer.

If you join the Army, you will get to fly helicopters you will probably get significant more flight time than the AF guys. You may fly more demanding missions you may not.

As far as high Altitude flights. I'm not quite sure what high means to you but the days of flying super low are pretty much over unless your a scout (going away) or your RP inbound.

Talon64 · March 5, 2014

In my experience, the pilots we flew with in the nuclear mission flew a lot. It wasn't necessarily straight and level flight. Remember when I posted something about certain liberties? Bc nucs are so important, we always flew low altitude and called it staying tactical due to the mission along w other caveats. There was a Flying mission every single day minus Sundays unless there was emergency maintenance at a launch facility or a SAR mission. Stick pigs of the month were looking at 30-50 hours a month! When you're the new pilot you're flying 3-4 times a week easy. And everyday we did tact exercises with our pilots and picked random sites and did insertions and extractions etc and all different types of fun flying that wasn't high alt level flying.

Talon64 · March 5, 2014

There were days where our pilots had to fly <300 feet due to low ceilings but the nuclear mission is a priority and often times would still launch. And on good weather we rarely flew above 1000 feet AGL

DaveC · March 5, 2014

Want to assemble furniture all day? Go Army

Corrected based on my personal experience.

Never go to an aviation unit that doesn't exist yet...

mxg0166 · March 5, 2014

I have been to Air Force flight school as a Marine. Those helo slots can be hard to get. My class only had one and you have to make it known thats all you want. Flying the T-6 is a ton of fun though. As far as the training we started only doing one flight a day until solo. Once you are done with solo you can expect 2 or 3 events a day. You can only fly twice a day but a sim doesn't count so you can do 3 four hour flight periods and max out on crew rest.

Caelus · March 5, 2014

Ultimately it boils down to, what do you want? You may not get a guaranteed helo slot in the AF but I can almost 100% guarantee your quality of life will be better than a Army Warrant Officer.

In what way? Because of AF vs Army or because of regular officer vs warrant?

Justine · March 5, 2014

I thought you know what your flying right after OTS selection...but i guess that is wizzo v pilot

CharyouTree · March 5, 2014

For reference, in both of my Afghanistan rotations I saw AF helos ONCE in over two years worth of being in country. I wasn't stationed on some big base either.

Lucky you. Every day in Bagram was an event when "Pedro" was out.

Overshooting the pad and landing on the taxiway instead? I think some of them thought that was the procedure.
Taking off from the taxiway
Taxiing past you while it's 5 degrees out and they're making a killer wind-chill? Slowing down then is a great idea.
Overshooting base to final? Why not.
Tower's cleared Pedro #3? Nah... Pedro doesn't have time for that. Just going to do what he wants. Hopefully you're expecting it, because he's not telling tower.

Caelus · March 5, 2014

I keep seeing this term Pedro for AF guys, what is it? CSAR? Helo pilots?

UH60L-IP · March 5, 2014

Yes.

Pedro = Air Force Helicopter CSAR

Fred0311 · March 5, 2014

Pedro did our casevacs while I was deployed. I can't speak highly enough of them. For the longest time I thought they were army though because they were wearing multicam and flying green black hawks. If there are any on here, consider this a thanks from a dumb grunt.

ShaneWey · March 5, 2014

I keep seeing this term Pedro for AF guys, what is it? CSAR? Helo pilots?

Jeeze, don't you watch NatGeo?

CharyouTree · March 6, 2014

It's their call-sign. The csar guys in particular.

CharyouTree · March 6, 2014

Pedro did our casevacs while I was deployed. I can't speak highly enough of them. For the longest time I thought they were army though because they were wearing multicam and flying green black hawks. If there are any on here, consider this a thanks from a dumb grunt.

Are you sure it was Pedro? I've not seen them in anything except grey Hawks with refuel probes. They also still wear flight suits.

Fred0311 · March 6, 2014

Weird right? I know their callsign was Pedro. Pretty sure 1-1. I always just assumed they were army because of that. Never bothered looking for insignia or reading the tail boom because we were fairly preoccupied when they were showing up. But about a year later I ended up running into some of their support guys and they said it was them. This was OEF 10-11.