Course chronology

[Jon B.]

Former LRSD... Not everyone in this form is a cherry at NAV...

 

I'd bet my paycheck you had at least 3 forms of GPS on that patrol with back up batteries for each system.

 

I'd also bet that you used man made features on those patrols to confirm your location and then moved to a man made feature to either observe or raid that man Made feature.

 

Point being, walking in the woods 1 click to a random flat ass hill is unrealistic for most people in the Army, and I'm not criticizing it because I suck at it, I think it's unrealistic.

I'll edit mine since you edited yours.

 

Nobody cares you were LRSD. Also, you sure talk about it like you're new to the concept. I'm not talking about using roads as in navigating in the SKY. We're taking land nav. On the ground. You know, with your feet, and probably a ruck and a weapon. People stay away from roads to stay alive. It's that easy. It's not a hard concept. I would have hated to be any part of your patrols.

 

You're partially right. I had ONE form of GPS, and it was only really decent at giving me grid locations. Meaning, it was good to check my progress with against my map and compass. If you suck at it that it's your problem. It's been (map + compass) a consistent way of getting around for a LONG time.

 

Also, there aren't many man made features (Super-walmarts I call them) to use when you're in the dark and using satellite imagery to travel from point a to b when you're in BFE Afghanistan. Otherwise known as the REAL WORLD.

 

Walking legitimately in the woods prepared me for that, rather than taking short cuts. It's called training.

 

I'm not trying to pick a fight, but I can't see how this is so foreign of a concept to someone who apparently is a "former LRSD" guy. Who would have done the exact thing I'm advocating.

[Jon B.]

Sigh.

 

You will do another land nav course in BOLC.

 

Lets keep the thread civil. WOCS and BOLC land nav isnt Afganistan, the long walk, or the star course.

 

Oh, and even more land nav in SERE.

 

I completely agree. Unfortunately, most things I say seem to come across very a**hole-ish. It's not a planned derailment. It just happens.

 

I'm not trying to be a d**k, it's just brutal honesty. Why sugar coat stuff?

[Joe_P148]

I'll edit mine since you edited yours.

 

Nobody cares you were LRSD. Also, you sure talk about it like you're new to the concept. I'm not talking about using roads as in navigating in the SKY. We're taking land nav. On the ground. You know, with your feet, and probably a ruck and a weapon. People stay away from roads to stay alive. It's that easy. It's not a hard concept. I would have hated to be any part of your patrols.

 

You're partially right. I had ONE form of GPS, and it was only really decent at giving me grid locations. Meaning, it was good to check my progress with against my map and compass. If you suck at it that it's your problem. It's been (map + compass) a consistent way of getting around for a LONG time.

 

Also, there aren't many man made features (Super-walmarts I call them) to use when you're in the dark and using satellite imagery to travel from point a to b when you're in BFE Afghanistan. Otherwise known as the REAL WORLD.

 

Walking legitimately in the woods prepared me for that, rather than taking short cuts. It's called training.

 

I'm not trying to pick a fight, but I can't see how this is so foreign of a concept to someone who apparently is a "former LRSD" guy. Who would have done the exact thing I'm advocating.

Ok guy, your the one talking all this sh*t like you've been there and done that and no one else has.

[Yamer]

Up until this last penis measuring bit, this thread has really helped me on my last day of freedom for 7 weeks. Thank you everyone

[skyreaper]

Another thing to consider about GPS is intentional access and accuracy degradation. A tool used against the enemy to fool them or deny access to our gps satellite constellation. There are also errors with gps that can cause problems. It's obviously best to know how to fall back on a pencil and your brain computer. Same thing goes for flying, knowing dead reckoning and how to plan/navigate off sectionals or whatever the Army uses for a VFR chart.

[Rob1237051]

Apparently they really softened up that course. You pretty much had to run to pass just last year and my class lost over 10 candidates. Maybe if they had considered some form of risk mitigation or an accountability plan back then that guy wouldn't have died a couple classes later. It's ironic that they'll chew out the "road guard officer" because someone forgot a vest, but no cadre were rushing to take oownership of a real failure.

 

Just play their games and flush the nonsense from wocs after you graduate. You'll learn the real stuff before you start IERW.

[Flim]

Any good vids on land nav ( youtube)? For a complete noob...

[Creep0321]

 

Forgot to mention too that you're not allowed to run on the land nav course (though the rules are always changing, so who knows what it'll be when you're there). When they say don't run, they mean do *not* run. Don't even appear to be. I guess several of those that "fail" land nav fail because they rushed and were deemed to be running. There's just no need. 3 hours to find 3/4 points, and you can use the roads.

 

Thats a bit different then I am used to.... No roads allowed, and expect to be running a good portion, with a ruck. So sounds like it should be an easy day.

[movingtarget21]

Apparently they really softened up that course. You pretty much had to run to pass just last year and my class lost over 10 candidates. Maybe if they had considered some form of risk mitigation or an accountability plan back then that guy wouldn't have died a couple classes later. It's ironic that they'll chew out the "road guard officer" because someone forgot a vest, but no cadre were rushing to take oownership of a real failure.

 

Just play their games and flush the nonsense from wocs after you graduate. You'll learn the real stuff before you start IERW.

I led the way in being the first to be fired! :-)

[Lindsey]

 

Just me thinking out loud here. But you guys ARE the new kids on the block, not leaders in the army yet, never had soldiers, etc. Just my $.02, i'm not a drama llama at all, but I figure you had bad prior service people.

 

I didn't see this reply before putting in my $.02 about the land nav. You were better off than most for sure!

 

We had some great prior service people--they just hadn't been in a lockdown course in a long time. Never said us street-to-seaters *weren't* the new kids on the block; obviously we are. Many of us, though, were quite content with WOCS' version of lockdown.

[akscott60]

Oh yea. Coming from BCT at Benning to WOCS was a nice change. All that freedom....hahaha

[Velocity173]

What's SERE like?

[brackac]

What's SERE like?

 

A lot less tiresome than this thread

[Creep0321]

What's SERE like?

Can be very entertaining, depending on your personality/physical capabilities and those of your classmates.

[WaterRooster]

What's SERE like?

The best corse you will never want to do again

[rharris]

Are we really arguing over land nav? Come on gents and gals, lets try to keep it on target.

[Velocity173]

I don't even remember having maps in Astan. If all 4 CSELs don't work, you're having a really bad day. Worse case, walk to highway 1, hitch a ride on a "jingle truck", show blood chit, home in an hour.

[apacheguy]

I don't even remember having maps in Astan. If all 4 CSELs don't work, you're having a really bad day. Worse case, walk to highway 1, hitch a ride on a "jingle truck", show blood chit, home in an hour.

Interesting point, are there enough people in A-stan who can actually read your chit...?

[Velocity173]

Interesting point, are there enough people in A-stan who can actually read your chit...?

At like 30 % literacy rate, probably not. If I put $$$ on it I imagine they'd understand that though.

[Talon64]

Lmao that chit is funney

[cwil7280]

^^ I see whachit did there.